WEBVTT

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 thank you for Professor Kong. Continue. Thank you for organized this session.

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 I'm a little bit nervous, so I will follow my note. It's a new research for me.

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Okay,

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good morning. Everyone. I'm hong jong-yang from academia scenic Taiwan today, in my presentation, focused on my on the case study of how Chinese guest brokers became Igwanga follows in Mauritius, and plus they ties in Iguan Dow. Back in China.

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My test study shows that in this process these Chinese guest workers, as well as Iguan downstairs

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from Taiwan, will be able to evade

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religious regulations imposed by the Prc. Government.

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What is it going to?

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First? Let me give a brief introduction to the development. We go down over the past century

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Iganda originate from a traditional sect in the Min Qing dynasty.

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then it adapted to modernity and transformed itself into a new religious movement in the

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thirties in North China, built as one of the Regentive societies.

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This transformation was not accepted by both governments across the Taiwan's trade, and it was still viewed as an illegal religion in China and in Taiwan

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until 1,987, when Taiwan abolished martial law, the Gwenda was legalized.

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Since its legalization, Iwanda has spread to

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to 84 countries, and established its head coaches in 13 countries.

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Meanwhile many in China

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started to reform and open a policy and various branch of iguanja, closely tied in China

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by means of low-profile strategies.

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with a square area, low China banned iguan Dao as one of the reactionary steps

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in the criminal law of the Prc.

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Before I continue I showed 2 pictures of the Iganda Buddha Ho. In the Uk.

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where the Iguana headquarters was established in 2,000 shown in the right picture.

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And let me

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introduce the

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the basic tactics in the richer's recon job. No matter where I goangal sprays. basic doctrines and reaches are essentially the same, including syncretism

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and the major deity of

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I'm bomb mother, and a mild Melanian design.

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And this second important deity, Matria Buddha is a savior and a co-reacher called 3 traders.

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You can look at a passage caught from my research.

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Their vegetarian lifestyle is a man

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features.

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and then

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I show you the picture of Iganda Buddha in the Chinese context. On the right hand the followers kneel down, and in total, sincerely

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on the left side. The statue of Confucius

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was placed in front of the table and met your Buddha was set in the back.

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Iganda is very active to pro solitized globally.

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He was in the late

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1980. S. Led the small temple was set up in Mauritius to personalitize to the Haka overseas Chinese

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in the locality. At the same time the population overseas Chinese amount to 30,000, while the Mauritian population of all was 1.2 million.

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many, consisting of Indian ethnicity and Creos.

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Here the picture shows a big temple built in the suburban of the capital city called Lewis.

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while which can

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accommodate fall to 500 people at the beginning no one could understand why such a big temple had to be built. It was not until the mid 1990 S. When the large number of Chinese-guest workers came to Mauritius. Let I go downstairs, realized the reason. Behind this.

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He is the inside of big chamber in Mauritius. Since 1,995.

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When the big temple was in all we rated, many Chinese guest workers, year after year have been introduced to recipients.

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participated in training lessons and became sincere followers.

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On the left side

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the Chinese jets workers were dressed in white and blue

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uniforms, kneeled down and sincerely coat

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in the

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in the put a hole

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in the right picture. The initiator being shaded, is like the priest, increasing energy.

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The initiator reduced the Chinese guest workers with a number about 20 in their dormitory and Berlin some food. In the left picture there were about 200 Chinese gas workers listening to the lessons in the temple, wearing uniforms met by themselves.

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Almost all the followers were women gas workers with only 7 or 8 men. Since these guest workers work in the garment and textile

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factories.

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Why, Mauritius

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Mauritius is not one of the developing countries that we often talk about, but in the mid 1980 S. Mauritius deliberately copied the knees

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experience. especially with Taiwan.

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Meanwhile the Us. And the EU offered due to-free and quarter-free benefits for the government and textile industry in African countries.

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one of the which is Mauritius. With the export orange it policy is set up ep. Z.

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The export processing zone which attracted entrepreneurs from Hong Kong, Prc. And Taiwan to establish government and textile factories.

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However, the Epz led to the writing native Mauritius workers. To make sure this industry continue to grow. The government allows this factory to.

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They import foreign labor from low-wage countries, especially China.

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In addition, the Prc. Government

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attempt to build up its relation with African countries. and Mauritius soon joined Prc's alliance.

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Here I call the passage from Professor Messenger.

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Okay?

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How many Chinese guest workers in Mauritius, from 1,995, when the big Igandal temple was completed

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to 2,010. This is the period when the number of Chinese guest workers reaches its peak

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in the same time

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the number of Chinese gas workers receiving Dao also reached its height. Thousands of Chinese gas workers came to Mauritius every year

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about

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2,500 to 3,000 received job every year. About 200 converts

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attend advanced training lessons every year. Within 15 years it is estimated that hundreds of cumbers took vegetarian valves

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and became missionary. Adapt.

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He I called table friends

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Santo and Tutu.

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Yeah. Another

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in 2,006 and 2,009 guest workers from China were estimated to be more than 8,000. The number of female workers was 2 to 3 times the number of male workers.

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the severe working and living conditions.

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These Chinese guest workers face included language barriers.

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regrettable dormitory conditions, and the lack of running water, and in sufficient number of toilets.

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And

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these female guest bookers got a wage of 200 to 300 Us. Dollars per month. Not much, but more than

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what they could learn by

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working on the fund, or as a present worker in

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China. Lafici's complaint was being exported and now treated by the factory managers.

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Also, Lee's worked. These guest workers failed.

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discriminated in Mauritius.

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in Mauritian society.

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and I feel that local Mauritians would not like to mingle with Chinese guest workers.

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for instance, as for code or others, shops.

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We can look at the incident. In March the twentieth 2 2 female gas workers from South China died in layer dormitory.

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the officials that they died of illness, but other gas workers. So the reason was not

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they died from over here actually, at least, peas and workers had unusual endurance. They over

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must go be young while they could endure

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from news reposed by rooters and major Chinese news. Media.

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female guest workers had a lot of partnership and complaints which are called narratives of suffering

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about long working hours, sometimes even 18 to 19 h per day.

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Male nutrition because of bad meals and hunger.

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I'm very bullshit in dormitories, and about 40 people shared one dormitory, and they had to weathered in the long line for the toilet

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based on the above description. I provide an analysis.

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we can argue that these female gas workers live in the double in collapse.

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increasing.

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ethnic in cloud and religious. Incl. The working and living space

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factory dormitory is a distorted ethnic in in the transnational social field.

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but it cannot form a small version of Chinatown due to the lack of the free time, public space, resources, and social interactions. In contrast.

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the equandabula hole is a reduced in which unexpectedly function as an alternative ethnic in with the familiar

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language, the familiar food and familiar and traditional Chinese culture.

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and in the Buddha Hall 2 kinds of caring was provided.

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secular caring and sacred, caring. First, when female gas workers failed.

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discriminated by the Mauritians, and exploited in the factories. They were welcomed with, etc., cattering the temple step with offered lame one wife

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house and greet them with spouse.

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Upon entering the Buddha hole, the Buddha hole provides you, Lem, with food, and they could chat and share the bellows from Hong Kong, and most importantly.

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medical translation services would be provided when they were in name.

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In addition to secular caring, the Booja hole provided sacred caring here in there.

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for example, the holy Zones describes a bone Malar waiting for Lem for layered children

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who went in the earthly world. Upon hearing these songs, the

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get workers, with tears in their eyes, miss their family, waiting for them at home.

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Some sincere female guest workers with cotto in front of the Buddha, and then bring the water over to the Buddha for those who were sick.

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After drinking the water. Some experience

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supernatural hearing

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story like this became supernatural. Narratives which encourage more gas workers to resip down.

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Under these second circumstances

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hundreds of female guest workers would spend their weekends in the Utah hall, cooking vegetarian meals together.

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handwriting moral books which they wish to bring back to Hong Kong's inner China.

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and in the condition of double in collapse a certain percentage of female guest workers

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when so deep conversion

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attending the training lessons for months or even years.

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Some took vegetarian valves and cultivated themselves by foxing on a layer heavily potal to control their 5 senses and acquiring an enlightened understanding of traditional traditional. 3 religions classics.

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after three-year-old contract guest workers returned to their hometowns, and

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some setup family moved a host like initiate. Mr. X. Said

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Mr. Alex. Was sent from Taiwan to China to provide assistance when they

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wish it to spread out.

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It is important for them to adopt low-profile strategies, strategies to evade the Government's regulation. For this reason Mr. X. Avoid saying too long.

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Stay in children at once. Twice

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myths used the metaphor to describe this situation.

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This initiator is like the cloud giving way to the young plans of down in every province.

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The cloud is now always here the sisters background. Mauritius alighted. Earth

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analysis of Dow in men in China could grow well

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by the narration of

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of the earth. The

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Mr. X. Realized that these simple and rustic sisters could use their local knowledge

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to deal with the local police or local officials.

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Here's an example of deep conversion.

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lady. While returning to her hometown in South China.

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using a root with a hole in the old house. The wren took up half of her salary.

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Lady Y also became the hub to contact guest workers who written, who returned to

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China from southeast China to northeast China.

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Another example

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is

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Lady Z.

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We can see how she. a couple, is the place, that is, Z.

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Being asked to report to the police officer

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about the experience in Mauritius, as well as the activities in the family. We got home in China.

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The police officers

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first

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lecture row you a them work

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with merely a primary school education. Don't be silly. Don't be brainwashed by the Kmt. Guming down agent in Mauritius.

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Tell me what you learned in Mauritius, and let D. Z. Research it immediately.

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The principle of the

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including to honor the parents, to vary the teachers, to chip face with friends. Or of this. And the police officers said.

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Go go away. Okay, okay, stop it. Watch yourself. Okay.

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My conclusion currently

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Iganda is not legalized in China. It is impossible to proselytize iguana without violating the Prc's regulations

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to evaluate religious regulations. Iganda has striped to find an in-between press like Hong Kong, Macau, or Kimman. The government is an island between

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men in China and in Taiwan.

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for people to gather from China.

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however located far away from East Asia. Mauritius is never expected to be such a place.

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Here are some features of Mauritius, which became an overseas nursery one. First.

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the unexpected result is being far away from China. Mauritius is another land where Iguan Dao can evade the heavy, regularly religious regulation.

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Second, Mauritius provides a secluded time space with a large number of guest workers from China. Mauritius offers a secluded time space for Chinese guest workers to became Iganda followers.

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The third

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high pressure and poor working conditions in sharp contrast with the caring environment in the Buddha Hall reinforce the contrast between

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suffering and happiness reaches its.

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It's

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we iterated in captain of traditional 3 religions, partisan

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Confucianism and Taoism.

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This research is still in progress here I present some ideas and

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analytical perspective. I hope to come brief

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this research in the future. Thank you for your attention.

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Okay. in the

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am I doing it right

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for stop sharing?

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Hi, everybody, thank you very much. We were leaving the question for the end, so we will be able to answer to all this. Thank you very much. Now I would love to. Oh, thank you very much.

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Sandra Perket.

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with no, it's a grad student post to it. Post-doctoral research fellow. Sorry, Sandra.

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at the University of Birmingham.

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I have following research.

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focusing on

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the relation between religion and gender-based violence. You know how the sphere of volition influence this kind of Prince, I believe in your research in Turkey and Tunisia. My right. So

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 Now, if the floor is yours and at the end we will do that question. Thank you, Sandra, very much for being here today with us.

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We're looking forward for your research.

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Sandra Pertek: Thank you so much to. I I hope you can hear me. Well.

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Sandra Pertek: yeah, we hear you. Well, excellent. So good morning, and good night to welcome to those in Europe. It is a presentation in the middle of the night. Luckily I woke up.

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Sandra Pertek: So here we are, as my honor to be with you, and I'll be talking about as it is introduced. Findings of some of my doctoral research on the region for the migration engine of this violence. I'll be looking at it from intersectional and ecological perspective.

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Sandra Pertek: So I would like to begin just to contextualize my talk by those 4 numbers. we know that they are currently around 100, over 110 million, the space people.

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Sandra Pertek: Many experience continue violence. we call, I call it continuum of violence, as violence that spreads across borders from countries of conflict to countries of transit during the refugee journey 2 countries of refugee

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Sandra Pertek: So we know that

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Sandra Pertek: well, all your evidence demonstrates as that many people experience violence during the refugee journey. The estimates of some studies show you one in 5 people in conflict, but also obviously show 17 women in 10 who experience sexual violence since arrival to Europe, where they were supposed to find refuge, they are subjected to sexual violence. For example, in some of the

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Sandra Pertek: European countries, that's 7 in 10 of women, and and up to 3 to 10 men. So the problem is very

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Sandra Pertek: prevalent, and violence is very much trended by science is very widespread, and

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Sandra Pertek: we also know that this very popular figure, that there are 8 in 10 people who still associate, affiliate with some religions.

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Sandra Pertek: Affiliation. This might be an expired figure, but I don't know if I don't. If there is a better one that it represents.

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Sandra Pertek: some of the current conditions of people. Maybe you could update me.

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Sandra Pertek: anyway, this is just the backgrounds demonstrating that gender based violence is a very important problem in force. Migration studies and the religion obviously in the sexes, experiences, research shows that religion, faith, and spirituality. Travellers with people across borders and people draw enormous strength from their religious beliefs, but also at times are subjected to violence because of their religion

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Sandra Pertek: or intersecting identities. And here I just wanted to introduce you my framework and the background information.

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Sandra Pertek: So this type that this we're based on understanding religion as a religious resources. I I looked at people's religious beliefs, practices, experiences, and organization drawing on their harsh framework.

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Sandra Pertek: and in the the line of my work I look at 2 substantive schools of fault. One is one domain is gender and migration, another one is the region and migration. And my study integrates those 2 areas

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Sandra Pertek: in order to respond to one research question, what what are the influences of region on Genevice? Violence in experience it offers migration.

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Sandra Pertek: So here I drove widely on to Intersectionality Ferry and the resilience vary, and I combine them both. You know the 2

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Sandra Pertek: understand the nuances and

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Sandra Pertek: people's and people's experiences of the region in force, migration, and genetic science experience. So I used this

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Sandra Pertek: framework integrated framework which is on the right. I will explain that further in a bit. But this frame of in a me to look at religion in intersection with other identity markets, such as gender, race, migrant status, age as well, marriage status

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Sandra Pertek: erez agmoni at different levels of people's ecology. So I looked at how it manifests at the individual level in personal relationships, in community and widely on on society level. And I looked at risks and vulnerabilities as well as the resilience resources. 250.

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Sandra Pertek: So here is just the methods introduction. I have deployed a mixed methods approach. So I conducted interviews with 38

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Sandra Pertek: force migrants migrant survivors, often the best violence in Turkey, Ankara, and Tunisia, in Medine and Jersey, Southern Tunisia.

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Sandra Pertek: data collection was in 2,019, 2,020.

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Sandra Pertek: And oh, I also run questioners with with respondents at this, after the interviews to understand the they level of religious coping. So I just use them

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Sandra Pertek: briefly, just coping scale and compare and try to compare it with them. Try to put it into context with Kesler. Psychological distress and post traumatic growth in entry.

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Sandra Pertek: yeah, I was responding to 3 questions on the key question was.

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Sandra Pertek:  yeah. How does the region intersect with with intersect with other factors to influence the vici refugee women's for an ability to violence. then what? Really? Just what are the richest resources available to refugee survivors that support them, and how this religious resources enable

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Sandra Pertek: the space one survivors a resilience and coping against them to be silence, and the final question concerns service. Providers whether they recognizes they are, it leave the reality of region in migration among survivors.

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Sandra Pertek: So I ask to what to? In what ways do they account for religion when they helps help for the migrants.

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Sandra Pertek: So I will move. okay, briefly, sample just for the details that they were mainly Turkey at Syria movement. I interviewed in Turkey, and just to Iraq, human and in to me that they were 15

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Sandra Pertek: African migrants of 10 different nationalities.

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Sandra Pertek: Most of the what all of them demonstrate. It's high, it's going to be stress. and

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Sandra Pertek: I also into it interviewed, he informed the key performance. Not not that many just

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Sandra Pertek: 5 each in each country plus internationally global interviews with international stakeholders. So findings

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Sandra Pertek: essentially religion

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Sandra Pertek: in this study was identified as part of gender based finance experience.

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Sandra Pertek: all but one respondent mentioned that the religion played an important role in the in the Refuge experience

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Sandra Pertek: and handling an experience of handling

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Sandra Pertek: a discrimination entrance based violence

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Sandra Pertek: throughout the experience since since across the refugee experience.

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Sandra Pertek: So religion we can be summarized in

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Sandra Pertek: white terms as an I bit of resilience, and. on the other hand, an intersecting risk factor

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Sandra Pertek: which actually manifests across different sociological levels. So one on one hand, 3 generals is spatially and temporary fluid intersectional availability

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Sandra Pertek: which shape the gender, culture and religion nexus

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Sandra Pertek: often what this next is, and their PIN family violence. I will just explain it in the next slides and the experiences of religious persecution alongside religious and micro discrimination, and, on the other hand, region

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Sandra Pertek: manifested as a powerful resilience, resilience, resource with survivors adapting very high levels of religious scoping which enable them to draw strength, meaning, and relief from day 5.

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Sandra Pertek: And

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Sandra Pertek: this was very clear among responders. Across 2 sets, those 2 settings that

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Sandra Pertek: a woman

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Sandra Pertek: the space moment they did, they put special efforts to conserve their religious beliefs, practices, and experiences

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Sandra Pertek: during the the refugee experience

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Sandra Pertek: and

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Sandra Pertek: which in one way help them to buffer some of the distress, some of the migrant stressors. but, on the other hand, it could also lead to to increase of spiritual struggles that increase the psychological distress.

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Sandra Pertek: if, for example, did, some would blame themselves for embarking on that dangerous journeys, or something that got this testing them or punishing them for doing something. So this

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Sandra Pertek: manifest well prevalent among those responses in Tunisia who, most of whom have I've

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Sandra Pertek: attempted not to, but multiple times to cross the Mediterranean Sea were all success, many of her of them experienced drowning in the sea. Okay, so

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Sandra Pertek: further information on the framework the reason why I choose this framework to and to ensure that we can capture a different

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Sandra Pertek: residents. And for the vulnerability factors at different levels.

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Sandra Pertek: And yeah, maybe I won't waste time here.

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Sandra Pertek: and the results are. There are so many factors that have shape the experience of gender-based violence in the first migration.

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Sandra Pertek: but religion is one of those intersecting factors that

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Sandra Pertek: that must be accounted for if we are to respond to those experiences and that that could be relevant.

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Sandra Pertek: Yeah, are the great way. and I believed in well, definitely. There were many. many accounts of gender at culture and region. Nexus

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Sandra Pertek: The, I just believe, have shaped attitudes and behaviors of either violence, tolerance, or.

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Sandra Pertek: oh, all resistance! And

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Sandra Pertek: I will be exploring the specific religious factors in the next slides. I just wanted to show you in this slide that there are so many factors, and the region is one of the intersexing factors that sh these experiences

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Sandra Pertek: oh, within them sorry.

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Sandra Pertek: complex.

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Sandra Pertek:  very complex experiences of people. obviously migrant status was one of those most

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Sandra Pertek: most pressing factors that have

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Sandra Pertek: precluded people from accessing aids and made them extremely vulnerable.

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Sandra Pertek: Across across the refugee journeys where they couldn't fix support because of a lack of access to services and fear of deportation.

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Sandra Pertek: Have they revealed the experiences of finance to authorities. Okay, so this is just a summary a religion has, especially in temporary fluid in section of one of the voluntary vulnerability factor.

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Sandra Pertek: So the and internal factors and

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Sandra Pertek: I'll be explaining those, for in incidents of discrimination into sectarian discrimination and culture of but they are interpretations

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Sandra Pertek: in the next slide. Based on this short. So Zola she was from Eritrea. She stayed in Tunisia, and she She was a Christian. She was talking about the increased discrimination because of her Christian identity.

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Sandra Pertek: Muslim respondents also felt that they were discriminated because of their race. So we can see

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Sandra Pertek: well, in Zola's example that her migrant vulnerability was gendered because she was a woman. She experienced extreme exportation in Libya

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Sandra Pertek: and specialize vulnerability in

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Sandra Pertek: in Tunisia because of of her origin.

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Sandra Pertek: That's

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Sandra Pertek: on. On the other hand, she would never say that she was discriminated because she was violated and subjected to sexual violence because of every region. Unlike Nina, who felt that she was subjected to violence

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Sandra Pertek: and right during the journey in West Africa, that migratory routes, because she was of certain Christian identity. She felt that she was targeted because of that.

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Sandra Pertek: but overall many survivors, that it doesn't matter to to perpetrators whether you are Christian or Muslim, because in Libya they just want to say, Give us money, and if you cannot, you will be raped if you are again.

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Sandra Pertek: So they abuse everybody without asking about their religion on respondents, that

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Sandra Pertek: in to me in Turkey I wanted to just show you this example of

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Sandra Pertek: who has been subjected to increased domestic violence.

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Sandra Pertek: being refuge because she had no no family collection. Her social connections were limited after leaving Syria, and her husband was already abusive in Syria has used this as

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Sandra Pertek: opportunity to increase his aggression towards him, because she knew he knew that she won. She hasn't. She doesn't have any social connections.

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Sandra Pertek: So there I was, this

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Sandra Pertek: There was an element of intergenerational violence that's made. Her situation was, and the norms that have traveled from the across borders

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Sandra Pertek: that, on one hand, now normalized violence.

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Sandra Pertek: but, on the other hand, religious piety, and has increased. He exposure to violence in in this incident because her husband was

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Sandra Pertek:  didn't tolerate her religious faith in higher power than himself, and whenever Brania referred to her as a religion, as a resource of respite.

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Sandra Pertek: her husband will increase violence as as a revenge.

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Sandra Pertek: And there were a number of different cultural issues there as well. But she was explicitly saying that her husband, in this instance he was as was he. Did you miss using that you just to justify his be abusive behavior as you could? I hope you read on this slide here

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Sandra Pertek: and under the 100 region. It was a power for resilience, resource survivors. yes, conserved they religious beliefs and practices in order to generate

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Sandra Pertek: a religious coping strategies.

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Sandra Pertek: and I see them as an integrating their mind, body, and spirits leading to cognitive behavior and emotional, emotional and spiritual coping strategies.

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Sandra Pertek:  this is what it looked like, more or less spring. Basically, spiritual

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Sandra Pertek: spiritual strategies depend. Where

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Sandra Pertek: were created by women's

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Sandra Pertek: metaphysical experiences of survival in in in extreme danger

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Sandra Pertek: cognitive strategies when generated by their religious beliefs. So it's help them to keep to make sense of the experience and to resist by drawing on egalitarian religious teachings from within day 5

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Sandra Pertek: behavioral strategies through on the religious practices. All day

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Sandra Pertek: they prayers, and referring reading the religious text, help them to keep calm and to connect to the divine.

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Sandra Pertek: And I have a session in 4 h explaining this phenomenon. Basically just go pink it for the extent here. I'm just quickly to wrap up. I don't. My time is almost up. Oh, it's up.

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Sandra Pertek: I would just needed to show you as well.

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Sandra Pertek: That is

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Sandra Pertek: phenomenon on marginalizing survivors. You just coping and needs by service providers in across those 2 settings. And also

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Sandra Pertek: in this international interviews. It was also apparent that practitioners tended to overlook the region, and to avoid it, not cause at an addition to in attempt to not cause additional distress.

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Sandra Pertek: So in all this is another strand of my research which demonstrates that that service providers

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Sandra Pertek: in that avoiding region. They just don't want to account for it because of different reasons and often operational. The policies don't allow them to to relate to today

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Sandra Pertek: as well beneficiaries of clients, religion.

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Sandra Pertek: and, on the other hand, there are some transformational approaches with Ngos and Tech and psychologies undertake more proactive approach to draw on religious resources, to help people overcome the distress and and struggles.

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Sandra Pertek: So I won't have more time to explore it. But in conclusions, in this very short snapshot of this study, which is very complex, and I hope you can read more. I will put in the textbooks a link to some of the policy briefings and papers. If you're interested to know more in summary in the integral, the integrated intersection, ecology.

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Sandra Pertek: What's proved useful for this study to capture both for anybody and the resilience factors of engine and business experience.

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Sandra Pertek: And I believe we need to further integrate those 2 approaches.

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Sandra Pertek: to mitigate the risk factors and harness survival strength and to help them recover more effectively even region matters to to

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Sandra Pertek: to people in the experience of virus and migration.

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Sandra Pertek: And

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Sandra Pertek: there are 4 recommendations that I have been putting in the policy. Briefing one is for humanitarian policy and practice to recognize the significance of religious influences from the Space women's resilience and vulnerability.

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Sandra Pertek: and in all them, in order to integrate reduce risk and resilience factors as a cross-cutting issues in all different policies that people organizations implement such as H. And a diversity policies. They should also account for religious factors. That's the cross-counted with those H. And J. And diversity

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Sandra Pertek: correct that he speaks, and for

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Sandra Pertek: mental health and psychosocial practitioners it will be. Really it will be.

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Sandra Pertek: It's very important to recognize and support that you just coping mechanisms of survivors, to just help them recover quickly quicker, and to operate within the worldview.

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Sandra Pertek: and for for violence, prevention will be important to develop 5 sensitive strategies that can reduce intersectional vulnerabilities drawing on people's religious resources. For example, in aging former female leaders and woman face organizations that can counter some of the patriarch interpretations.

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Sandra Pertek: But that's all that's about for for people subjected to domestic violence. It could be very important. So thank you for your for your time apologies for over running, and I'm done here. It's a pleasure to meet you.

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you, Sandra, you you stop, or really the sharing. Now

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thing? Yeah.

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thank you very much. 2 wonderful, wonderful examples of good research on religion and migration, especially because both of them

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deal with this kind of how the religious process transform people experiences and their religious experience. So thank you very much. Now, we open for questions.

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 among the people here. I will ask if you can please come to the microphone. So everybody online can hear. And then also people online. So

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oh, actually the microphone got to you? That's even better.

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It's more. Yeah.

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Do you have a question?

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So I did. I'm your

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yes, of course, so she can see you. So it's good, Sandra. We have somebody who wanna say hello to you in person.

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Yeah, we haven't seen each other in many years.

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I'm so glad to have finally see you present on your work, having followed you from afar.

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Have a few questions, and I apologize for missing the first presentation. So I'm only going to write my questions to Sandra. first. I was.

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I was interested in knowing whether

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you found any in in your research. There was any data that showed like the lack of consideration for religion in service, provision, and humanitarian response.

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and as a barrier to accessing services, or as a reason why, for example, women might stop engaging with services during their journey.

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and you know, or choosing to go to a service rather than another. So how that played in terms of help seeking behavior?

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the second question is more around your recommendations in terms of

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and how just basically elaborating a bit more on your last recommendations around how Mhpss. Actors can

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take into account religion in their work, especially in contexts where

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the

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respondents that helpers and are not from the same religion as the migrant population.

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Then my third question, sorry for having so many, is whether you've found any

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like evidence, or you know or just, you know, from your own experience, not just in your research and around Islamophobia, in feminist approaches to gender-based violence, and how that plays out

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in those spaces, in the services that support migrant women. And

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yeah, if you have any thoughts around how to address that.

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Sandra Pertek: Oh, thank you.

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Sandra Pertek: happy to meet you, and thanks for those 3 questions. So and well.

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Sandra Pertek: E. Well, in my study, the woman who didn't speak directly about

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Sandra Pertek: limiting at seeking behavior because of support of service providers being safe, insensitive to their needs. that

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Sandra Pertek: they would like. For example, I remember one survivor from Ivory Coast.

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Sandra Pertek: She would say that nobody was asking about my region, and I didn't know if this is appropriate to talk about. And she said to my outrageous, My religious needs are equally important as my other needs.

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Sandra Pertek: I remember she she was a survivor, survival of sexual violence, and she really drew on her Muslim faith, although she was invisibly Muslim. Let's say she didn't want a scout, so nobody could say why she well, for service providers they wouldn't say where she's from. Likewise the survivor from Aitria

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Sandra Pertek: who really survives horrors on this earth. She has been the only survivor of 20 people who were

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Sandra Pertek: yeah, who died in the attempts of crossing Libyan borders and European borders. and she said because she weren't a scar. But she was Christian. She said that people would think that she's a Muslim

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Sandra Pertek: and they but she it wouldn't. It would be to her. She found disadvantages in the setting where she was, where she was, in that was Southern Tunisia, where obviously wearing a scout man that you were probably a Muslim. So she she said that she's advantage in that way.

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Sandra Pertek: But as a as a psychologist who was part of him

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Sandra Pertek: for her environment. She would say that she she didn't know until maybe until a year of interaction with her, what was her religion, and she couldn't draw on this reasons that she had. She was a a strong believer.

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Sandra Pertek: so it was a missed opportunity. But it wasn't it was it didn't come out as a as a buyer in the setting in Turkey

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Sandra Pertek: to some extent. Maybe that was a barrier. The Service Provision mainstream service provision for Syrian refugees was was quite secular, although they were.

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Sandra Pertek: I remember, in some of the mainstream community centers. They

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Sandra Pertek: and I was doing it to have current classes, for example, but, on the other hand, they try to implement mindfulness as a coping, as a healing strategy for some of the one. I remember that the that

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Sandra Pertek: so there is service provided herself, she said. That woman rejected to to engage with mindfulness sessions because they didn't find that at appropriate, and she blamed their religious beliefs. They the religious

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Sandra Pertek: they, they religiousity as a as as a barrier to engage with mindfulness sessions in coping strategies.

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Sandra Pertek: and when it gets to yeah, well, Islamophobia, this is what I know from mainly test based research and from interactions. What we're still okay with the other studies that I've done what Islamophobia manifest, right.

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Sandra Pertek: as, for example, in Sweden and the Uk survivors would.

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Sandra Pertek: Well, we're saying, you know, the projects I've worked in that they were often stereotyped, and they were patronized, based on their looks. And they will. Some some service providers will speak like social workers will say to them. Now you can take off your scar if you don't need to words. It's you are now in this country, and they would feel it's obviously very inappropriate, and they would feel me stretched. Why, they were it.

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Sandra Pertek: there is evidence from Canada showing that those service providers who good to exhibit

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Sandra Pertek: discriminatory behaviors.

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Sandra Pertek:  are creating barriers for users to access them, and woman survivors of them.

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Sandra Pertek: We will like to protect the image of the religion which will mean that they will probably not 6 support, because they will be fearing

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Sandra Pertek: they will feel that they will be stereotyped, and the religion will be misconceived.

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Sandra Pertek: Well.

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Sandra Pertek: So there are some notions, and I think we should extend our outrageous literacy to be able to engage with some of the Patriarcha interpretations that and their P. Moments experiences of domestic violence, particularly to be able to counter it and encourage people to seek support, drawing on the

379
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Sandra Pertek: alternative religious interpretations that promote the protection and honoring woman all the different good things that protect people from violence.

380
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Sandra Pertek: While in context of the the second question in context of supporting survivors of different religious faiths.

381
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Sandra Pertek: I think there are ways of doing it through inter

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Sandra Pertek: building religiously, to see among different practitioners of different sides, to be able to engage with different people's beliefs. I think, equally as we promote gender sensitivity, H. Sensitivity, we should promote gender, that religion, sensitivity, or what to to all different.

383
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Sandra Pertek: the nominations

384
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Sandra Pertek: line nominations. It's unfortunate that some of the humanitarian agencies.

385
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Sandra Pertek: like, for example, some of them participate in this study.

386
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Sandra Pertek: particularly they were those who are headquartered in the Western words. They would have policies that that that instruct training of social work and psychologists to to avoid issues of religion, and

387
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Sandra Pertek: one just before I finish once. One respondent was.

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Sandra Pertek: she's very good story with me, she said, that we were not instructed to. We were told, commanded not to talk to religion, to survivors who came to us for for support.

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Sandra Pertek: and she felt very bad about it, because those women that she she was working with. Believe that they violence is an is their destiny, and they should do not much about it, because that's what it got disting for them. And she felt that because of this policy being invested so much in

390
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Sandra Pertek: different world views, this wasn't a missed opportunity to support the healing if they were able to engage with this con definitely. Just so here I finish. Yeah.

391
00:50:42.960 --> 00:51:09.009
thank you very much, Sandra. maybe that question for for you. And then I will do a question, maybe, for both of you, but I won't point during your paper you were talking. I mean, it's such a fascinating bottle. You have a fascinating paper. But in your case it's very interesting. You know, that they stay control, binding or religion. And then the experience of conversion happens somewhere else because of the experience of immigration, and then they come back to to home.

392
00:51:09.020 --> 00:51:16.190
At 1 point you talk about persecution, even in prison or contact with the police.

393
00:51:16.480 --> 00:51:24.369
My question is, when these members of this community encounter this persecution back in their hometown.

394
00:51:24.540 --> 00:51:27.009
how can you see any?

395
00:51:27.050 --> 00:51:40.949
How do they see this as parents of persecution from that religious point of view. Do you think that religions have helped them to see that one? How how I had been this one back at home.

396
00:51:41.320 --> 00:51:44.640
Yeah. I think, Liz.

397
00:51:44.910 --> 00:51:52.750
this simple and rustic sisters local knowledge to cope with the

398
00:51:52.940 --> 00:51:58.739
the police offices. And normally they won't be detained.

399
00:51:58.760 --> 00:51:59.820
Just

400
00:52:00.090 --> 00:52:05.749
that's huge. Yeah, some questions. And then they know you learn some

401
00:52:05.770 --> 00:52:14.529
traditional classics and Mauritius and let let you go. But you've played some someone

402
00:52:15.510 --> 00:52:18.440
have some criminal criminal events.

403
00:52:18.490 --> 00:52:19.990
then.

404
00:52:22.160 --> 00:52:23.670
then,

405
00:52:23.800 --> 00:52:28.780
the Lee's sister, respect to their hometown may be.

406
00:52:29.040 --> 00:52:38.439
Maybe it stands for 3 months to one year, or I have some cases like that.

407
00:52:38.500 --> 00:52:42.830
like baby very often. Yeah.

408
00:52:43.050 --> 00:52:49.320
thank you. I have a question for both of you. But I don't know if anybody online of a question.

409
00:52:49.660 --> 00:52:53.789
maybe. Can it? Or Cherry or Manor yet?

410
00:52:54.190 --> 00:52:56.500
Do you guys have any questions?

411
00:52:58.510 --> 00:53:18.900
Ok, if that, I'd wait to ask a question, and the question is a little bit about my methodology. You guys are dealing with very complex communities. people who are moving from one place to the other. People who are going through the. In the case of Sandra. Maybe people who have gone to the tension centrist moving from one continent to other all that kind of stuff

412
00:53:19.080 --> 00:53:24.450
you're dealing with the difficulties of a community who is migrating and moving

413
00:53:24.470 --> 00:53:27.720
at the same time that you're dealing with an illegal religion.

414
00:53:27.900 --> 00:53:30.260
So I'm thinking about.

415
00:53:30.670 --> 00:53:56.960
You guys can tell us some of the challenges or some of the tools that you have used to deal with such a complex world. So from the points of methodology. How you had done this, you know, and you follow these communities during that time before and after. So methodology. Yes, I mentioned how it has been for you to do something so difficult.

416
00:53:57.910 --> 00:54:05.990
Yeah, I'm still follow this case, and I have not too many cases

417
00:54:06.350 --> 00:54:10.069
about the the sisters. From

418
00:54:10.080 --> 00:54:28.440
Mauritius. I learned much more message from the temple step, who were in Mauritius in the COVID-19. The 3 years these temple steps stayed in Taiwan, and I interviewed

419
00:54:28.500 --> 00:54:30.580
these temple steps

420
00:54:30.800 --> 00:54:42.029
much more. But before the Covid I I've attended a gallery temple carrying, and I

421
00:54:42.270 --> 00:54:44.689
I come across it.

422
00:54:44.830 --> 00:54:48.219
A young man, a young man who is

423
00:54:48.240 --> 00:54:51.049
the son of one of those.

424
00:54:51.180 --> 00:54:55.920
This is from Mauritius, and we talk much about

425
00:54:56.250 --> 00:54:57.140
is

426
00:54:57.250 --> 00:55:01.930
his mother's experience, and that expanded me very much.

427
00:55:01.980 --> 00:55:03.180
Thank you.

428
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What about you, Sandra?

429
00:55:06.030 --> 00:55:17.449
Sandra Pertek: Well, I try to deploy this kind of spatial, spatial, temporal sensitivity in my methodology. But obviously I interview with people at some time, so

430
00:55:17.750 --> 00:55:20.780
Sandra Pertek: oh! My studies were bounded by

431
00:55:20.890 --> 00:55:30.619
Sandra Pertek: by 10, by timeframes and methodology. It was inclusive enough that I could adapt to it with semi structures I could. I could just

432
00:55:31.300 --> 00:55:45.120
Sandra Pertek: and sure that the questions were relevant to different to people expressing different level of reaches ofly, of religiousity, and it was so open and sensitive, and

433
00:55:45.510 --> 00:56:01.430
Sandra Pertek: people could I? Could I? I was adapting it according to what people wanted to focus on in this discussions and all that, but on that critical note it would be great to ensure that we are able to do the studies at different stages. Obviously not only

434
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Sandra Pertek: in the country. Of what a different stages! When people migrate during their journey, and one day. especially in one place of refuge, and if they move to another, it would be great to check what happens then?

435
00:56:13.860 --> 00:56:18.850
Sandra Pertek: but this was a limited limit, that there were many limitations of my study, and

436
00:56:18.940 --> 00:56:32.129
Sandra Pertek: for future I would I would love to deploy a longer term, long it to long it to in a approach, perhaps, if possible, to try check. How them religious dynamics and the religious experience changes over time.

437
00:56:32.750 --> 00:56:36.190
Sandra Pertek: So i' to go to

438
00:56:36.470 --> 00:56:56.880
Sandra Pertek: spatial sensitivity. Well, I did remain in contact with many of my respondents over time, and this is beyond the study and time timeframe. But and I feel that this is extremely valuable to know what's happened, what happens to people and how their lives evolve, because this just increasing our understanding of

439
00:56:57.130 --> 00:56:59.810
Sandra Pertek: yeah of the different factors that trade day.

440
00:57:00.640 --> 00:57:04.950
Sandra Pertek: And they

441
00:57:06.190 --> 00:57:08.010
Sandra Pertek: thank you for that question, though.

442
00:57:08.140 --> 00:57:14.380
No, thank you very much. Thank you very much. I think this is wonderful, you know, for both of you. It's such a

443
00:57:14.460 --> 00:57:20.929
innovating work. And I'm thinking, for a example, about how also legally status

444
00:57:21.090 --> 00:57:30.570
and the complications of legalized and normalizing status for many of them, as they arrived in Europe, may also have an influence in the

445
00:57:30.650 --> 00:57:39.200
different levels and impact of the violence, the experience, including all the different steps.

446
00:57:39.320 --> 00:57:57.780
being forced to in a retention center and then finding a job. And we will notable in time for the jobs and the visa. You know all those kind of things amplify, and also how religion may provide for some of them, network or support, but also network of vulnerability, you know, in terms of

447
00:57:57.800 --> 00:58:11.700
they are alone when they have family. You know all those things, so I feel that you are open. This kind of Pandora box. Of all these many different layers, including how the State agencies may have

448
00:58:11.730 --> 00:58:16.190
colluded, you know, in created condition. Open that, I believe, for some of them.

449
00:58:16.280 --> 00:58:19.490
despite the fact that they may claim that they are secular.

450
00:58:19.590 --> 00:58:21.969
But they did not really practice.

451
00:58:23.000 --> 00:58:30.649
Sandra Pertek: Yeah, yeah, thank you. exactly. There is lots of creation of this violence dependencies, especially in the

452
00:58:30.760 --> 00:58:33.289
Sandra Pertek: European set setting, where

453
00:58:33.680 --> 00:58:51.370
Sandra Pertek: where survivors often are depending either on they either they choose between homelessness or remaining in a busy relationship because of the lack of access to support services to on due to their legal status. There are lots of different provisions in different countries. But yeah, thank you. I shouldn't be interrupting.

454
00:58:51.830 --> 00:58:57.130
Professor J. I think something interesting with you is at 1 point. You're talking now about

455
00:58:57.280 --> 00:59:06.249
the emergence of a new generation, you know, like, at at 1 point, it's look like at every sort of focusing on those who have converted and moved back.

456
00:59:06.450 --> 00:59:14.679
And now, as you say, we had the children with some of those families, so it would be interesting to see what happened

457
00:59:14.970 --> 00:59:33.109
to those kids who grow up in a family who have been converted now living in China. So they move into a different stage because they did not experience the process of conversion that the man, so that did in the oratios.

458
00:59:33.180 --> 00:59:42.079
but for them they have been more normalized under the circumstances of so valiant of this state. So it's interesting that now your research expand

459
00:59:42.340 --> 00:59:46.650
in the second generation, you know, as you say, about the firing. So that's wonderful.

460
00:59:48.850 --> 00:59:53.670
I don't know if anybody have any more questions. Oh, yes, you have a question fantastic.

461
00:59:55.000 --> 01:00:07.040
Thank you both for your really really interesting presentations. I might start with you and Jen. I was just wondering what's next. What's the future for your research in this area? Where are you going next?

462
01:00:08.680 --> 01:00:11.180
Going? You you mean my.

463
01:00:11.660 --> 01:00:28.360
that's the college or yeah in this. At the end you said that it was an evolving analysis, and that you were, you know, this is New York. So I was wondering where you going. I'm just waiting for a good moment that these sisters can move

464
01:00:28.650 --> 01:00:42.410
to, to to stay in Kimm for a week for a training camp, and if I also join the cam, I can interview with

465
01:00:42.480 --> 01:01:09.359
the sisters. But due to the for 3 years, I'm still waiting for the for a chance. Yeah, excellent. Okay, great. Thank you. and Sandra. I was just wondering in the interviews. Did the women speak about the tension between the religion being a resilient source, but also a source of vulnerability. I was just wondering if you could elaborate on that a little bit more.

466
01:01:11.420 --> 01:01:17.939
Sandra Pertek: Yeah. And they would speak about it, but they would emphasize first of all, that the religion

467
01:01:18.280 --> 01:01:26.149
Sandra Pertek: it's it's very much helpful to them. They wouldn't like that to criticize the I think this is obviously

468
01:01:26.440 --> 01:01:27.470
Sandra Pertek: yeah.

469
01:01:27.690 --> 01:01:31.789
Sandra Pertek: They obviously is very difficult to be critical of your own religious beliefs.

470
01:01:31.820 --> 01:01:36.670
Sandra Pertek: So woman would always start from saying, violence is not allowed in my religion, and

471
01:01:37.080 --> 01:01:55.690
Sandra Pertek: it helps me to cope. It's everything that they, especially among the Syrian refugees. This they spent on the religious worship, the individual practices they, many women, had nothing else to do but just rely on the religious practices throughout the day that kept them going.

472
01:01:56.230 --> 01:02:06.849
Sandra Pertek: and with regards to religion, they would say that men don't, and that men don't understand a religion. This is what the Syrian woman may be saying that

473
01:02:07.160 --> 01:02:26.710
Sandra Pertek: men misinterpret. What's what is in the in the religious scripts Scriptures? And therefore they would not rely on any made interpretation like maybe the group of people I came about across those, my, my respondents, as we like to the limit as we like to refer to

474
01:02:26.800 --> 01:02:29.850
Sandra Pertek: when I met and interviewed. They have

475
01:02:30.170 --> 01:02:41.059
Sandra Pertek: they have various levels of religiously to see. So some of those who were trained in religious law, for example, they would be very

476
01:02:41.070 --> 01:02:53.419
Sandra Pertek: protective and of day of the way they would talk about their religion, because they know that religious religion is very their religion. In this, in this case Islam is very much misconstrued by many actors.

477
01:02:53.430 --> 01:03:01.479
Sandra Pertek: so they would be even in engaging with me. And I'm a Muslim myself. That will be very worried how I'm going to capture what they say about their religion.

478
01:03:01.640 --> 01:03:18.010
Sandra Pertek: some of them. And they would say, yeah, they they really wanted to probably show the good face of their religion. But then we would reflect, and we would talk about different interpretations, and they would say, we have with regards to some verses I would be as probing for specific

479
01:03:18.060 --> 01:03:36.119
Sandra Pertek: explanations of how they understand some Misc call quotes from the radio Scriptures that perpetrators don't like to misuse to the advantage. And they would say that this they would just explain it in different way. like. There's there's lots of different layers of like

480
01:03:36.140 --> 01:03:50.880
Sandra Pertek: different woman would explain it in different way, depending on like the same.  yeah, of what? This is. Another presentation, probably. But they they they they they love to talk about.

481
01:03:50.990 --> 01:04:00.450
Sandra Pertek: And I. I came back there actually. So during my postdoc, which is finishing some in April, actually, I I went back to Turkey and talk to

482
01:04:00.490 --> 01:04:12.250
Sandra Pertek: the communities meeting again some of the survivors I met a few years ago. and we talked about in detail actually, this, how culture and religion intersect and

483
01:04:12.740 --> 01:04:23.500
Sandra Pertek: and they would be having so much about a vibrant views between themselves. But they would like to protect the, and they would say they would like to be critical of

484
01:04:23.740 --> 01:04:26.159
Sandra Pertek: of religious.

485
01:04:27.100 --> 01:04:30.280
Sandra Pertek: How do we all of How people

486
01:04:30.350 --> 01:04:40.419
Sandra Pertek: of really just norms! They wouldn't like to criticize it. It just norms. They would blame everything on culture. Yeah, maybe that's a very simplified explanation. There's obviously so many different you in this.

487
01:04:40.830 --> 01:04:41.730
Of course.

488
01:04:42.030 --> 01:04:46.970
Sandra Pertek: if you're interested in specific examples I could elaborate. I don't have time. But yeah.

489
01:04:47.490 --> 01:04:49.700
Sandra Pertek: thank you.

490
01:04:49.730 --> 01:05:12.470
Thank you very much. Everybody. And I mean, we enjoyed very much the section also because of the intersection between labor, capitalism and feminism. You know how they inter in religion. They all have been there. I think if there is no more question. We can end a little bit earlier. So if, because, you know, there is only 2 panels. But also we want to say something. Maybe I can do

491
01:05:14.330 --> 01:05:16.120
so. You can see it.

492
01:05:16.840 --> 01:05:30.169
you know. Think about us also a resort to help you guys. For all of you. We're looking forward to read how the project evolves, and all the new, you know, advances and things, but also feel free to contact us.

493
01:05:30.170 --> 01:05:57.830
If you want to ask to, you know. Read your material, if you need any resources. If there is a question. You know I was thinking some that you talk about in Islamophobia and feminism. That is something that in all the primary American culture we have several scholars who do a feminist approach to Muslim studies and query studies and migration. So please feel free to Do not stop the relationship. So just in this panel as you come up and on and leave.

494
01:05:57.830 --> 01:06:27.740
but also that we are part of a larger community that we here to help each other. So if you need anything, please contact and let us know, and we are here to support you on hell, doing everything that we can to be sure that you have a good experience doing this amazing work about religion. migration, okay, thank you very much. Everybody, Janet and Sandra. I will see you later on for another panel. You're super brave, and thank you very much. Everybody for being part of of today. I'm I'm powerful. I don't know if you want to say something on that.

495
01:06:27.860 --> 01:06:32.349
Okay, so we soon thank you very much. Everybody. Thank you. Thank you.