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Yeah, we organized this session on what we can maybe say the other whites. So we have papers from different parts of the world.

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And I want to a long introduction because we have quite a few papers. So we will have the papers consecutively and then hopefully they'll all be sticking to time so we have some time for taking questions at the end.

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So our first speaker is Irma. Please, Emma.

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Good morning and welcome. I'm glad to see you in the audience and not walking in Melbourne this morning so I really appreciate that.

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And today I'm presenting a paper that we wrote with my colleague Dominica Blochinska Tatsuk.

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And she is from University of Warsaw. Her affiliation changed in the meantime since we submitted the abstract.

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So our vapor focuses on Poles and Las Vegas in the UK in the context of Brexit and in the title we actually use the other whites as a category that is even used in the administrative data in the UK.

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So witnessing a lot of research coming up on experiences of Eastern Europeans in the UK and racialization.

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We realized that class is one of the dimensions that is less talked about in this research. And we were part of a larger project.

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Call Sea Youth. Connecting Polish and Lithuanian institutions and funded by both research councils.

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And as a mixed method study, but today I will mainly rely on the qualitative longitudinal study data, which included several waves of interviewing both in person or online and as in Chronos interviewing and here as in corners we mean we were writing up to participants after a while checking on how they are doing or when COVID came

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that was a good time also to check in how the situation of them. The project is over but we keep writing.

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And a few, notes on the research participants. There were 77 in total as you see polls on Lithuanians more women than men that happens in this type of research.

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We diversified in terms of sampling from different locations and they lived in the UK before the Brexit referendum.

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That was precondition for recruiting them in the study because initially we wanted to see how they will behave and how the repercussions of Brexit will affect their lives.

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And, whiteness as as a question or as a category did not we do not foresee it as a major category when we started research.

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We were focusing on their experiences in the UK. But both Dominic and I kept noticing that the talk about how the deserve to belong in the UK.

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How they have houses, how they have proper jobs, are there these other bad migrants. So we realized there was something there.

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And we turned to the literature on hierarchies of desirability and where we see both race and class as a site of negotiation which happens migration as a side of negotiation where these kind of positionalities are resisted.

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And also there are certain aspirations to be classed in a certain way. Respectability is also something that research participants who have fewer resources may seek out more than the others.

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And for these various practices and various discourses, they try to demonstrate that you do belong to UK in this very unfriendly environment that we do belong to UK in this very unfriendly environment that was the Brexit referendum.

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So he belonged to the community of value. And the D research questions, we set out to answer was what forms of racialization we can notice in their narratives.

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And how middle class resources can help to escape this racialization that they encountered.

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So when numerous Eastern Europeans moved and I say Eastern Europeans also knowing that this is a category, but let's embrace it for a while because that's how it's used.

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They were white. They were exercising the free mobility right moving to UK. And this Brexit referendum partly, acted as a wake-up call.

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So yes, you can blend in, but at the same time you are different because in the media polls and also Romanians were often mentioned in quite negative contexts in the Brexit referendum.

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And these previously simple questions that they remember and refer back to looked a bit different in the context of Brexit.

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So for example, Cornelia, shared with us how, when she says that she's from Poland, there is less excitement compared to her husband who is from Brazil and there are other accounts of not being from Holland or and so on when Poland and Holland is mistaken and so on.

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And the other example comes from Lithuania and a sample which slightly differs in terms of the way they can be.

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Invisible in a way because everyone talks about Poles and Romanians mainly but here it is after being asked where she's from, Ada answered that she is Lithuanian.

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And then she was reminded that there is 1 million Romanians that came to London since 2,014.

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So she answered that thanks for letting me know and laughs and this kind of small laughter is also something that kept reoccurring in the way they spoke.

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What she also asked that it doesn't hurt her anymore as it used to before for so many years.

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So there's also this adjustment to constant questioning or constant need to explain where actually you are from. And this is a everyday bordering practices that their interlocutors apply.

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So this, this served, these, these practices and these aspirations were there before, but Brexit showed them in a different light to our research participants.

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So in the context of such questions and such everyday bordering practices, how do our interview participants escape or can escape?

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And here's an abstract from the interview with a Fitchard who was on a very successful Tinder date until he heard if you would have sounded more Eastern European you would have been that attractive to me.

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Richard is a professional who lived in numerous countries, Anglo-axon countries. He has high cultural, social and economical capital.

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So for him this kind of remarks he just brushes them off and and moves on. And similarly, Amelia who is also in a good job in a media company.

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Confesses how she tries not to showcase her polishness. She tries to blend in and she can lend in easier than other colleagues.

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She also remarks later that the crew in her office is mainly black and that's kind of Compared to the other groups, she is way more, she can escape it much more and hide her polishness.

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Not being able to identify through the accent of through the locks. Are the get the capacities that some of our interlocutors possess.

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On the other hand, we also had quite a lot of narratives about trying to hide polishness or lusciousness but to a different for different ways and to different degrees.

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Here we have Kinga who was unemployed at the time of the interview. And she shared how she even of once talking to her daughter who is small in in public spaces.

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So that everyone would know that, would not identify them as polished and would not be able to question their right to belong.

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So this kind of impression management is very important for steaks are much higher being in a much more vulnerable position.

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And the other strategy we, we observed, was, Turning to.

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Ideas or conceptions of lower class to refer one's position visa with other groups. And here, Astra comes from interview with Yolanda and she was recently promoted as a section leader at a factory.

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And in her narrative, She refers to Brexit as a good thing happening in the UK because it will get cleaner a bit, she says.

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It will get clean from these gypsies, non gypsies. A lot of people came here to imagine that you can come and you can do nothing, steal the drugs.

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I take benefits and so on. So in her narrative, these gypsies and non-Gipsies are actually categories that add encompass.

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Various groups and this bordering actually happens on in terms of resources but also in terms of visual markers in terms of a capital that different groups possess.

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So being herself in a less secure position and this is not a single extract, Amanda kept coming back to similar narratives and she was not alone in our interview sample.

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Shows how having less security in the UK may also influence interview participants to use these other ways to racialize others.

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I was a bit briefer being afraid to run out of time. So yeah, I know but I'm already at the conclusions.

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So what we try to show with Dominica is for these few examples that I shared with you is that cultural capital and other types of resources may help migrants not only to pass as white, but also to pass as middle class white.

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And a steep certain forms of racialization that other groups have harder time to do. And this kind of racialization that they face is also less problematic and less felt for them if they have a good standing in a good situation in the country.

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On the one hand, they are more accepted in the community, but this acceptance is always conditional.

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And this regionalizing class forms of othering that Eastern Europeans but also other migrant groups may encounter in the UK or the context.

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Constantly makes them forces them to prove their good migrant status. And at the same time, reaffirm their class position, hiding their Eastern European origins or turning to othering other groups to help their position in the UK.

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So race nationality and class are lived, negotiated and resisted by migrants and we see these categories as relational.

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They are constantly changing and requiring actual work to be classed to be seen in a certain way. So they can be both experienced as a privilege.

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As a burden and as a weapon for othering others.

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And here's the snapshot of our article that was published as last year. It took us 3 years to write so there were a lot of discussions.

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And this article built on other work with a larger group of colleagues, Paula Poussuka is here but presenting in another section, Ethan at at exactly the same time.

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So this do I deserve the first question that we raised led us to a conversation about class and racialization and currently we are writing a paper on understanding of class.

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How Las Vegas are both not having these categories in their vocabulary in the whole country are trying to even sometimes turn to English when they speak about these kind of questions.

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So I'm very curious to see other presentations from other contexts to draw in the current research.

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Thank you for your attention.

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Thank you very much. Emma from, Poland and or Eastern Europe, we go to, Poland and or Eastern Europe.

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Hi there.

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We go to Tampaolo and hopefully I'll be able to do this. I have to hold on it's loading I think but She shares her screen.

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II can. Yeah, my screen. Yeah.

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Are you sharing your screen? Okay. Maybe I need to go into the zoom Just one.

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Yeah, you need to hear your screen so I can share mine, I think.

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Maybe if I close this no

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So.

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Okay.

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Let me just try this one. There's room in progress. Maybe we shouldn't be idle here.

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Do you mind if we go to Chile first and come to Carmeneli after you so that I can get some help.

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I got stuck here a little bit. Is that okay? Yeah. So, okay then.

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No problem. No problem.

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If we can, please have our third speaker, Makarina from Chile. Yeah. So if you guess, we'll come back to you in 15 min, please.

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Okay, well, hi everyone. Well in this presentation I'm showing the main results of a paper called We are a bit browner but we still belong to the white race making whiteness in the context of south-south migration in Chile.

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This article examines how Telans redefine and claim whiteness in a working-class neighborhood.

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It contributes to regional Russia studies by analyzing how whiteness is constructed in multicultural neighborhoods where different national and Russia life identities that share a colonial past converge and where the nation state has historically pursued a progressive widening through the adoption of racist state policies.

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These study shows that in Chile, whiteness is an ongoing everyday social construct that is not only conveyed outside this course, but also through the practice of performance of power in the social textures of urban life.

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It reveals that making an inactive whiteness becomes a way in which Russian hierarchies of belonging are materialized to achieve a higher status in an unequal Russiaites society.

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I argue that making whiteness through everyday practices and discourse reproduces anti-indigenous and anti-black racism.

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There has been an historical disavowal of racism in Latin America. Whyness has historically been taken for granted in southern countries like Chilean and the narrative of Mestizaki or misgenation understand Chilean national identity as constituted solely by European Spanish and Indigenous ancestries, yet rejecting any African

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ancestry. This is due in part to the scanned African presence as compared to other countries of the region, but for most to the historical rejection of the presence of aforechilians who still have not been counted in the National Census.

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There is a reluctance in Chile to talk about waste and instead class has become the predominant social marker of inequality.

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Yet this obscure the complex intrinsic relationship between race and class. A race still shapes social relations and interactions in the everyday.

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The historical denial of racial difference in national narratives had erased racial struggles or race relations in the country until the recent migratory flows, a orphanage and migrants, especially from the Caribbean.

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However, Asmodi and Solomon must argue the scope of racialized relations is broader than the black and white focus and the idea of whitening makes racialization a complex and contradictory process.

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As it will be shown here. In that sense, the acid will be shown here. In that sense, international migration has been key to unveiling this.

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In that sense, international migration has been key to unveiling these complex processes. Just to verify, in such a context, I would define myself as a white mystica, which is related to being from a well of family as race and class in Chile are deeply entangled.

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According to back, whiteness is a discourse and practice of power. It's invisibility reveals significant aspects that help sustain racial domination in everyday encounters.

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And an endographic approach to the everyday is then vital for understanding the ways in which white privilege works in South American countries.

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Racist state politics in Chile have been grounded in colonial times and the foundation of the nation state on the systematic denial of the presence and rights of indigenous communities.

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And, a who were just recently in 2,019 acknowledged by the state. This politics also informed the adoption of migration policies that have historically restricted non-white migration while encouraging European migration.

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The Italian state selective migratory plan for the sake of and I quote improving the biological conditions of race in 1,953 crystallized the pursuit of whiteness associating the arrival of Europeans with development and improvement of the Chilean Russian composition.

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And these policies have been perpetrated in several ways throughout the years and especially with the last right-wing government.

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And this study consisted of a seventeen-month ethnography in a historical multicultural neighborhood of Santiago, Ragoletta.

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I also conducted 70 in-depth interviews with Telana migrants. And focus groups. I show here how Tillans construct a white racial identity visa-vis the presence of Latin American and Caribbean migrants.

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Tillians, long-term migrations and newcomer migrants living side by side constantly compete for the same resources and public spaces in their struggles to get by.

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Overcrowding is an extensive problem among migrants and they're only able to rent rules due to the uncertainty they usually face in their migration status.

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I found out that whiteness is enacted by marking special boundaries and thus exerting a specialized form of power.

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I observed how students claim ownership toward urban space imminent in in many sorry subtle but repetitive ways to construct the racial identity as whiter.

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Some of these ways, a are first by claiming migrants assimilation to children's behavior and customers through implicit and explicit practices.

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And second by advocating a racial difference when naming migrants in public spaces.

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Tina participants overly or implicitly assert power by making migrants feel out of place. Explicit examples of this can be seen in science offering rooms for rent only for chillians or the tilian flag we see in this photograph placed in a collective housing where both Tillens and migrants live called Site.

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I'll show in another article, they emerged the coexistent problems that exist in the neighbourhoods in the neighbourhoods are related to the way migrants in Avit and the precarious housing condition they faced that determined their everyday practices.

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In conditions that they are forced to live in. The conditions are so led inevitably to in celebrity and this has been perceived by tensions as cultural practices.

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The idea in some chillians regarded as an established cordial practice allows students to position themselves at a higher hierarchical level,ing whiteness through a set of binary oppositions.

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They are darker and dirty. Butillions are whiter and clean. According to Douglas and birthhold, cleanliness is related to civility.

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A whiteness and high class. A and whiteness is symbolically associated with purity and thus morality.

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Dillon's rank migrants based on how their performances of inhabiting and behaving a simulated tile way which they tend to describe in association with the image of a clean, quiet, a sober person.

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Behaviors associated with established moral order. The morals, ethics and particular culture they presumably have become indicators of whiteness.

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And these values enabled Tillians to produce a supposed radically different culture within the working-class neighborhood they all share with Latin American and Caribbean migrants.

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In the discourse of Chileans in general, the idea of a dominant culture that migrants must follow and acquire in order to belong prevailed.

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And however, considering migrants as a race different from their own which would be the reason why they behave differently according to Tillians it becomes impossible to fulfill their expectations.

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Naming the other is also a way to assert whiteness by a position. A Lavega is a well known urban market.

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The street vendors, many of whom are migrants sell vegetables at a cheaper price. In this crowded place, many chickens perform ongoing constructions of whiteness.

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Every effort-descendant migrant was called Moreno, Moderna or Modernito or Negro, which means little brown, little black.

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Anna, a street vendor from the Limited Republic was called Lamarinea, little brown girl.

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She was her skin color. Calling after a sentence, More Anita was widespread in street markets.

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Thus student participants see migrants as a uniform group. This terms reveal how 2 different processes emerge simultaneously.

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First, the negatively racialized other is positioned in an inferior power hierarchy with the use of the diminutive Ito, a which uncovers the paternalistic attitude of the speaker.

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A second by calling migrants Molinitos or Negroes, Tillians assert a white Russian identity for themselves to regain a better social ranking within Chilean society.

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Despite their work in class conditions. In this narrative, someone else is at the bottom of the Russian hierarchy.

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And working class student participants are relatively better off. Following whole when people talk about the other they are also talking about themselves by contrast since the entities are constructed through positions.

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Thus chillians produce power narratives that cement the colonial white supremacy myth.

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In the focus group, participants asserted their whiteness. For instance, portray hate chance as radically different from Chileans.

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They are underdeveloped to explain why they cannot adapt. This coincidence with the way African people were portrayed in colonial times during Chile's new republic as foreigners who liked correct manners and were ignorant and lazy.

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The reproduction of racist logics thus remained almost intact. Here, when asking participants how they would define themselves racially they said, Tian, very proud to be Chilean.

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We belong to the white race, says Javier. And then one asserts, we are considered white when I was in Haiti they told us we were white sorry we are cafe the whites are white no you are white we are black That distinction that makes the African because we are white and they are black.

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We are a bit browner but we still belong and we are we still are and belong to the white race and failure continues when the Spanish arrived they messed with indigenous and it produced its population so we are like in between Europeans and Latin Americans like Mestizos says Isabel.

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So, all participants concluded that they were racially white yet linked to a particular Chilean race that biologically undermines students physical and intellectual futures as mestizo.

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Yeah being from the wide race implied being more developed, allowing children participants to reproduce the historical neglect of their own indigenous and African ancestry by distancing themselves from the Turkish and Caribbean migrants.

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This Russian character would seemingly make them different from people of Naomi in countries like Peruvians, even though they share a colonial history.

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So there is a peculiar vision of MESSISACHI that as a social discord has remained key to reproduce the idea of a national homogeneity.

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In acting whiteness, every day in contracts to Black American and Caribbean migrants becomes a way to protect the presumed Thailand white identity that has been historically threatened by indigenous communities.

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The weightiness asserts their racial identity in a position to refer the sentence differs from the way they conceptualize a contrast between themselves and migrants from neighboring countries like Peru or Bolivia and this is what most struck me actually and it was surprising.

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So Russian mixing with that for the standard migrant was seen as a threat to TLens alleged homogeneous whiteness.

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But when self comparing to black people it seems evident to them that they belong to the white race. Unlike migrants from neighboring countries who share ancestral similarity with chillians.

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For student participants, African Americans are not seen as competitors. See that's were thought that no people of African descent remain in collector colonialism, so the National Common Sest has said that African ancestry was not an ingredient of national identity, although this was not the case.

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Afro ascendants are seen by genus are as belonging to an inferior race, they are situated at the bottom Parisian order.

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So what happens is that chillians feel they need to compare themselves in cultural terms mostly in relation to southern corn migrants perceived with more indigenous futures and in such cases making that difference and ascertain they were whiter than Peruvians or Bolivians mattered even more to assert their allet wide advantage.

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To conclude, the presence of a migrant has reinforced the construction of whiteness and a kind of white privilege that before Megan's arrival was not claimed so directly in the everyday.

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I argue that whineness becomes a discursive mechanism that chillians use to build barriers that materialize in the everyday Russian hierarchies of belonging.

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This is what makes the struggle for resources a relevant factor to an knowledge along with the way race and class are deeply entangled in such a racialized and classed society.

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A thing here, the formative construction of whiteness constitutes powerful mechanisms that allow children residents to claim a superior position in a context where they have left a left a field left behind by the local government.

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Thus in increasingly Monte Carlo neighborhoods and context they need to redefine and reproduce racial identities in the everyday in opposition to other migrants becomes a fundamental tax.

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A task due to the struggle for resources. So, this everyday practices and interaction provide the opportunity to feel better off in the social hierarchy wherein they have been excluded.

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So for working classilians, migrants are the ideal scapegoats. So they need to differentiate from migrants perspective that's mestizo rather than aflace and that migrants makes the construction of whiteness for most and an indigenous racist strategy.

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Being meshes like other Nature American Caribbean. From neighboring countries drives students to differentiate themselves by claiming a whiter ethnic background which reveals that the Mesasaki project found in the history of many Latin American national contexts is unstable and relational.

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And so this construction of whiteness allows a rejection at the local level of what the Chila nation state has historically sought to dissolve.

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The indigenous ancestry that is part of this Mathiso identity. It is not surprising then that defining Chile as a pre-national state was one of the most controversial aspects in the debates on the New Constitution and one of the main reasons why the Constitution was rejected in the last referendum.

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And so thank you. Here are the details of the paper you want to to read.

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Come to help us but they're not here yet. Does anyone worth this have to go back to the Oh, hold on.

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Where is this next presentation? Return to session display. Okay. They said that if I click on something outside of here.

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It should work. There you are, yeah. I'm not sure what you might. And then also we have to come back to this so if you can let me know how to do that as well.

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Just press the escape button here. Oh, okay. The escape button. And it brings back the menu.

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All right. Did you need anything else? So we need this Carmen to speak now so we need to go to the Zoom.

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Stop sharing.

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Mainly.

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Yeah, that's it. Thanks guys. So in order to go back after she speaks you want me to escape you?

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Please.

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No, now after she's finished you can go to share screen and then bring back yours okay thank you I can do that that's easy enough thank you so it's all right thank you very much and thank you for being patient with us Morgan and thank you for being patient with us Morgan and waiting your turn so thank you for being patient with us Morgan and waiting your turn

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so with us Morgan and waiting your turn so we are now going to Brazil yes the floor is yours and you have 15 min And I'll.

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Thank you. Can you see my presentation.

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We can see on slides and we can hear you. I won't be able to give you a warning so make sure that you have your 15 min or as I'll come to the podium.

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Thank you.

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Amazing. So thank you for having me and I'm sorry, can't be there. With you.

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Currently in Brazil conducting fieldwork. So it was. Very far from me. But yeah, so my name is Morgan.

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I'm at the end of my second PhD year and the article I'm gonna present is drawn from the field work I'm conducting for my doctoral research which is looking comparatively at how police officers produce whiteness and white entities in Sao Paulo, Brazil and in France in Paris.

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But specifically for to speed around building on the work I've been doing in Brazil. So the question I'm asking specifically in this paper is how the construction of a police identity through socialization practices influences the way the way police officers specifically mixed race police officers make sense of their racial identity and so the argument I'm trying to develop is that the

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police is an environment for officers that provides element of racial socialization that incentivize them first to disavow blackness and instead second to think of themselves as closer to whiteness.

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Whether it is in the way they self-identify racially, whether it is through the narrative, then the attitude they develop on race.

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So good thanks to you before I say anything else. I think there's at least 3 things that need to be known.

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The first one is that military police in Brazil are mostly composed of black and brown men and this has long been framed as one of the main paradoxes of violence in Brazil but with some exceptions we don't have a lot of understanding of the ways in which these officers make sense of their racial identity.

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The second one is that in the paper I really choose to focus on officers who have a degree of racial and dignity in them and consider themselves somewhere along the spectrum of mixed rice.

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And so this is inspired by a body of work in Brazil. Make sure you brown individuals in Brazil have long been ignored in the literature, but in fact that, there is a diversity and multiplicity of meanings to explore there that, would be interesting to, to know about.

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And the last thing is that really this article is part of my effort to sing the links between police and whiteness and particularly sync police as a symbolic space in which whiteness can be negotiated and acquired.

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Which is an argument that from my point of view is not so much explored, although I've been inspired by one argument, in your textbook in 96 that argued that Irish immigrants also earned their inclusion into whiteness in the US by massively joining police forces.

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So really thinking how the profession can become a space for some who are at the margins of whiteness to prove their whiteness.

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Very briefly thinking about my methodology. I'm building on what is now 6 months of photographic fieldwork within the military police of Sao Paulo in Brazil to an includes participant observations of daily policing street work mostly ride alongs within police cars in 3 police units of the centre of the city so many informal

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conversations also semi-structured follow-on interviews and a large majority of mindfulness are men of different ages.

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And different status. So in order to think about these things, I look at 2 different groups of police officers in my data.

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The first category is officers who describe themselves as mixed race but they are very reluctant to give a significant student racial identity and they made very strong efforts to resist political forms of racial identification.

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What makes this result interesting specifically is that all of these racial identity narratives or only systematically link to references about the police.

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Sometimes up to the point that some of them come up with this. Conflation of the 2 arguing with this bold statement that produces what matters police is my race So what I try to do is in practice 2 identity meetings, with the argument that the processes they undergo in the construction of their police professional identity requires them

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to adopt specific ideas and positions that influence the way they make sense of their racial identity and reflects some logics of whiteness.

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So what I find specifically in this first group of officers is the following mechanism. A lot of them who identify as mixed race explicitly do so in opposition to another racial category.

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Wish in Brazil and Portuguese is the racial category Negro, which is the sum which designated some of those who identify as black and brown.

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So this category is the most politicized to refer to a black identification and it's also a Brazil often linked to the narrative of the Black Brazilian movement whose who aims for summing, of joining together these 2 categories makes trace and negative.

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So in the narratives of these police officers what I understand is that they learn somehow to reject this category in favor of for less threatening mixed race identity as a way to distance themselves from a political blackness seen as specifically threatening and dangerous at the moment for the institution and as such prove a form of loyalty and a form of belonging to the

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police before any other community and specifically racialized community. In fact, those who adopted a virgin narrative, particularly those who are considered as mixed race by their peer officers.

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If they choose to identify as Negro instead, which is kind of the exception. Are seen with suspicion often their racial identity is unvalidated by others and they are submitted to peer pressure.

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So what we have here is A mood of whitening informed by the necessity to get closer to a professional identity that add up certain ideas.

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So officers incorporate that the expression of the specific blackness, particularly inationally in biggest offices is viewed with suspicion and other positions such as the expression of deep politicized racial entities the promotion of racial mixture and and the the minimization of the relevance of race are welcomed.

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And so these positions are all reflected in the meanings they're giving to their racially mixed identities in the interviews and conversation but also the ones that they give to to their police identity.

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So while the officer is like talk to often reject the importance of race in contrast they always emphasize their police at identity instead which is filled with pride filled with meanings up to the point again that some come up with this statement police is my race.

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So what we see is kind of police identity eventually working as a form of color blind, and matching the central cultural expression of whiteness which is this ability to to self identify first as a mutual individual before, belonging to any kind of racialized community.

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And then I have the second group of officers who more explicitly suggest changing their identification from from mixed race to wise or even from Negro black to white after entering the police.

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So here I explore the idea that this whitening is connected to the presence of fertilization forms within Sao Paulo's military police that opens up possibilities for officers to sink of themselves within the margins of whiteness.

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And specifically I bring up 2 cases. The first one is that of a young officer who grew up in a favela of the state of Frio and he used to consider himself as a black as a result of his family considering itself as such.

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And so he mentions never really questioning this identity and until he entered Sao Paulo's military police where where he described acquiring a new socialibility, being exposed to new interactions and a different narratives on race that recompose the way he perceived himself.

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So he realizes that his police fierce potentially to see him as white because of his light skin and phenotype and so now he says he considers himself as such and then the second face is of his senior officers who explain to me that to him.

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Wearing a police uniform could modify Lawn's race and so he argues that if he wasn't police and instead if he decided to wear certain cultural symbols like tattoos he could be perceived as mixed race or or black but because he wears a police uniform and his kid is quite light and he now feels white.

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So what's interesting is that in both narrative, these officers positioned themselves within whiters by making a conscious effort to define this thing degrees of whiteness.

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So in the first case, a young officer is telling me that he feels white but he understand he's not as wide as his colleagues who have a Italian or German ancestry and the senior officers tell me he feels white but he understands that he may not be considered as such in context.

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Yeah.

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So in other words what we have here is police officers who understand that there's police officers who understand that their inclusion into whiteness who understand that their inclusion into whiteness is only partial but you understand that their inclusion into whiteness is only partial but use some of their police attributes is only partial but use some of their police attributes to help

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them stand within the margins of this category. So these police attributes can be the adoption of a new racial narrative like the one of the young officers who explains that learned is something very contextualized, only descriptive, related to phenotype and skip color.

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But also going further whatever I understand is that many officers perceive some powers military police as having a civilizing role so particularly in the military police as having a civilizing role so particularly in the first training phase what we see as having a civilizing role.

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So particularly in the first training phase, what we see is a common idea that the institution is taking individuals who often come from pooling phase, what we see is a common idea that the institution is taking individuals who often come from pools.

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What we see is a common idea that the institution is taking individuals who often come from pool urban peripheries or favelas and they make them into something else.

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So they make them into officers worthy of the institution, periphery or, and they make them into something else.

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So they make them into officers worthy of the institution, also worth you of working in the more noble and wider part of Sao Paulo by changing their ways of behaving, talking that that posture.

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And so this aspect is also more broadly connected to a common narrative about South Power, military police, which is often depicted as a noble and progressive institution because of it's, known, European, roots, in, opposition, to, other, less, advanced, military, places, of, Brazil.

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like, in And then I have this last part and I won't go too much into the details, but the idea here is to present a contrasting exception.

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So the case of an officer whose racial identification and shifted from mixed race to black while he was in the police.

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And the idea here is to show that it is often the exposure to alternative socializing environments that can counter the effects I described.

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So the case I present is that of an officer that after 17 years of serving into the police entered university to complete an undergraduate degree in psychology which is passionately about and so he's all his whole life he's considering himself as a mixed race he's considered race as specifically descriptive as something that didn't make

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much difference for him. But after his entry to university and and also other personal events that led him to get involved into spaces that gave him more cultural sense to race and specifically to blackness.

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He developed a different racial sense of self. And so this new racial identity also came with a strong rejection of the previous professional police identity he had built for himself so he's now for example able to to see racial discrimination within the police.

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It's important to say that this case is an exception. It's important to say that this case is an exception.

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I only encountered something like this case is an exception. I only encountered something like 2 or 3 cases of officers with the same trajectory of officers with the same trajectory and all of officers was the same trajectory and all of them are characterized by exposure to Alternative socializing frame.

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So here the idea is really to sing that it matters in the end to consider the importance of different socializing frames and how they interact in order to analyze the role of police socialisation on self-racial identification.

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And second also to understand that police and entity, whether it is adopted consensually or rejected seems to have a significant impact or is a significant parameter to understand how self-racial identity is understood in this in these officers.

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I will stop here and we'll, we will take questions later. So thank you for listening to.

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Much for keeping to time as well working and sorry we couldn't have yet when we needed to but we have heard you and it's good good and you can hear us and hopefully we'll talk to you later when you have questions.

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So I'm going to leave. No, I don't leave. I minimize this. Oh, okay.

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Yeah. So I have to click on this. Okay. So we are now going to Australia.

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Our speaker is from Australia, but the talk is about Indianness. Is it just the arrows, yeah?

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Hi, I'm Kathy. I am based in Australia. I am originally from the UK or kind of and it is going to be India and also back in time as well a little bit.

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I would like to begin by acknowledging the traditional owners of the unsuited land on which we're meeting today.

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The world will run jury people of the cooling nation and pay respect to them and their culture and to elders past, present and emerging.

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Sorry, I always think that this poem is a really good place to start any discussion on colonial understandings of the English race.

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So this presentation is based on work that I did as part of my master's thesis on the formation of Anglo Indian identity within colonial India and it drew really strongly on these kind of unsettling ideas of the unsettling potential of racial hybridity.

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But over time I've kind of got involved in whiteness studies particularly in Australia. And I started to question whether looking at this kind of colonial mixed race identity purely through this unsettling lens as a signing of fixedness to whiteness that really didn't exist at that point.

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So by trying to integrate some of this earlier work on racial hybridity with the kind of newer work on whiteness.

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I'm interested in how white racial others help to form rather than just to unsettle understandings of whiteness.

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And this poem is one that I've thought about a lot because I'm really interested in how we went from celebrating the English as a mongrel, half bred race.

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To this idea of English racial purity.

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So just a bit of brief background. So Anglo Indians is the name for people who are of mixed English and Indian heritage race.

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What kind of race? And it's been a bit of a contested term. They were originally called Eurasians and Anglo-indians was also used for white people born in India, but Anglo-indians is the name that they have identified with.

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So in the initial phase of British presence in India, Mixon was really encouraged. So from 1,687 the East India Company paid money on the birth of a child and intermarriage was seen as this way a means of social control.

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So marriage and kids were seen as a way of taming soldiers and settling these kind of working-class soldiers.

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But things really changed in the late eighteenth century early nineteenth century and this was partly because there were increasing numbers of soldiers so in the middle of the eighteenth century there were a few 100 British soldiers and by 1790 there were 18,000 and obviously more anglo-indians as well and this led to more Anglo-indians as well.

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And this led to moral concerns as well. And this led to moral concerns, particularly around things like marriage and, particularly around things like marriage and illegitimacy, but also increasingly around race.

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And this was part of things like marriage and illegitimacy, but also increasingly around race. And this was part of a wider kind of colonial context.

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But also increasingly around race. And this was part of a wider kind of colonial context. So there were slave uprisings and revolutions in the wider colonial context so there were slave uprisings and revolutions in the wider colonial world and all of this led uprisings and revolutions in the wider colonial world and all of this led to a kind of

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a change, a really big change in British policy in India. So around this period a series of prohibitions and controls were introduced that stripped Anglo Indians of many of their rights and also completely demilitarized them.

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So I'm not going to go into a history of race, but we can say that race was clearly linked to and harnessed for colonial conquest as this quote from Disraeli shows this idea of difference in high superiority and that leads to predominance.

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Of course we know as well that racialization is a dialectical process so when we racialize a group as other by certain biological criteria were also racializing ourselves by the same criteria.

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So Indians were naturally weak. In contrast to English strength and discourses of race delineated very clear divisions between different races and these were described in things like physical features and capacities, mental capacities, behavior and character.

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But white racial others confounded this somewhat, particularly those that lived alongside and followed English customs. As Anglo Indians did.

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But of course race isn't stable, we know this as well. So Stella talks about a changing set of features from which the essence of race was derived.

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And this was kind of increasingly focused around blood as encapsulating this racial essence. And I argue that it was the presence of white native others.

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And I argue that it was the presence of white native others that contributed to this presence of white native others that contributed to this and also in the process created a mechanism by which.

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And also in the process created a mechanism by which poor English could also be excluded to this and also in the process created a mechanism by which poor English could also be excluded from the category of what it meant to be white.

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So a lovely quote from the s on hybridity. I should stress this was written by someone in the Americas, not India, but even so there's a massive, massive contrast if you read this with the early ideas of this kind of half-baked Mongol race and of course key here is that the parental elements were

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very diverse. This idea of diversity appearing even back then. So part of the project of constructing race and racial superiority was the simultaneous denigration of racial hybridity.

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But the question of course is how to distinguish the fermenting monstrosity and perversion of the hybrid when you have racial others which have other phenotypic markers of whiteness so they've got white skin.

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So as we'll see, race becomes distinguished by markers of dress and of speech and all of this comes to be anchored in this notion of blood.

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So blood as a signifying a right future of races. It's a feature of colonial rule.

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So in the Americas you had the one drop rule and Wolf talks about how relations with slave populations were structured around labor and the need to keep a subordinate labor pool and so any black heritage was enough to make you black.

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So made black blood the most powerful blood in the world. While for indigenous populations, relations were organised around a logic of elimination.

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So any white blood was enough to negate indigeneity and thus also claims to land. And in India, in India we get the emergence of this idea of the British race.

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Anchored in whiteness. Although then as in now there was a lot of slippage between Britishness and Englishness, which is not something I have time to cover.

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But we find that increasingly the policing of racial mixing through concepts of blood was a way to defend but also to create an idea of what it meant to be English in the Indian colonial context.

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So Anglo-indian women were kind of stereotyped as beautiful and sexually promiscuous, but also with these shrill voices and harpy like personalities which contrast to those stereotypical ideas and understandings of both Asian and white women within this period.

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And Anglo-indian and white women within this period. And Anglo-indian men were seen as weak, incapable and self-loathing and they were parodied, both of them, for mimicking the English.

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And so I have a few quotes for you here. So Homie Vaber, he speaks about this kind of unsettling potential of mimicry and that's something I focused a lot on in my earlier work as a way to kind of highlight the power dynamics but increasingly as I think about the

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development of whiteness, I think we can read this as a tool. By what it meant to be white was constructed.

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So when differentiating Anglo-indians or Eurasians from British settlers or Eurasians from British settlers, there is a policing of dress and of accent as you can kind of read in these quotes and of accent as you can kind of read in these quotes.

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And we can see dimensions of class in here as well which I think relates well to what other people have been saying. And we can see dimensions of class in here as well, which I think relates well to what other people have been saying.

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We see that of class in here as well, which I think relates well to what other people have been saying. We see that still ongoing.

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So the white working classes, we see that still ongoing. So the white working classes in India and in Britain were also constructed as inferior and lesser.

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And part of the issue with Anglo Indians was that they were also constructed as inferior and lesser.

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And part of the issue with Anglo Indians was that they would kind of double the other. Because the vast majority of them were also lower class.

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And I should say that the Anglo-indian Dandi is it's unclear from the text.

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This is from the 18 hundreds, unclear if they're talking about a British, an Indian born white person or an Anglo-indian.

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But we can read the presence of white racial others as threatening to undermine British superiority and difference.

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And this wasn't only kind of manifested in these kind of discursive constructions of difference but also you know policies and practices like the removal of white children, white Anglo Indian children from Indian mothers.

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But we can also read this process of defining what was aberrant and the policing of difference, so how you wore your clothes, how you pronounce certain words as sharpening the contours of race in particular whiteness.

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And it's from this period kind of going forward that we start to see these differences anchored in the notion of blood as an underlying marker of race.

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So I want to talk you through a story by Roger Kipling which highlights how the supposed kind of racial differences between Anglo-indians and the English function to construct colonial whiteness.

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So his chance in life is a short story about an Anglo-indian called Michael D Cruz who worked at a railway station, which is a very Anglo-indian profession, who looks down on the natives as only a man with 7 eighths native blood in his veins cat.

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So he's portrayed as debased and self deluding with pretensions to Britishness that are clearly unwarranted.

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And the tone of the writing is very kind of mocking of these people who are imitating British customs.

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So he gets promoted to another station and when he gets there he finds that there's been a mutiny while all the British are away and the Indians are portrayed as either militant or cowardly so they're kind of the angry the angry Muslims or the passive you know Hindus And the police inspector

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turns to Michael for instruction as the nearest thing to a white man obeying the old race instinct which recognises a drop of white blood as far as it can be diluted.

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To despite his fear, Michael takes control and quells the rebellion with his heart large and white in his breast.

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And when an Englishman arrives the next day, Michael felt himself slipping back more and more into the native and his previous courage and strength disappears as he breaks down in tears talking to the Englishman and Kipling says it was the white drop in Michael's vein dying out though he did not know it.

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So revealed here is this kind of double need to present the Anglo Indian as debased while still elevating the value of white blood, significantly not English blood.

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And even though the white drop in Michael's blood elevated him around the natives in the presence of whiteness he fell back to his proper position.

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And like I'm saying, a really telling feature of the story is how the drop of English blood in Michael's vein is coded as white, not English.

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And this focus on blood as a distinguishing marker of whiteness develops and strengthens over time.

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So by the early 1,009 hundred's so a century after those earlier quotes I saw you I showed you a couple of slides back we see that Anglo-indians are predominantly consumed as mixed blood not as mixed blood not as mixed race or not at all these other terms but as mixed blood.

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And even though the women can be described as almost blond, their whiteness is derided as anemic.

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And we still have these familiar references to accent and clothes and this conviction that the mixed blood can never be mistaken for the pure.

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But we don't have any references to English blood. So we have references to the English and all the British so there's this kind of ongoing slippage between English and British.

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And later in the text there is reference to mixed white and Asiatic blood. But within India the blood of the English is conceived of as white, not English.

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And in the US, there's been this kind of distinction made by I think it's Gogli Elmo, but I think it's Google Elmo between color, race and ethnicity race.

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But in India we really see this conflation of color race with ethnicity race. So in India we really see this conflation of color race with ethnicity race.

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So Britishness is whiteness. And significantly there is an emphasis on the European born Englishmen.

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So what does it all mean? So I would say white racial others really shaped what being English meant within the Indian colonial context.

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It sharpened these ideas of whiteness. And whiteness becomes coated in blood even in contrast to other phenotypic traits even more than say white skin and it's your blood that donates the capacity characters and this becomes manifested in subtle markers of kind of dress behaviour and speech.

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I think this is important because during this period there was a lot of slippage between what was called Domicile Europeans who were poor whites who were born and lived permanently in India and Anglo-indians and there's a lot of this kind of going on.

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And although marginally higher in status, due to their white blood or English blood, should I say or English heritage, the 2 groups were often referred to interchangeably.

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And I think that having this category of excluded, non-recognized kind of non-whiteness, ostensibly anchored in blood but manifested in multiple other subtle markers of difference, allowed for the exclusion of poor working-class Indian-born whites from the ideas of Englishness as well.

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So they're not even recognised as English. They are seen as domicile Europeans. And this in turn allowed for the development and promotion of classed and gendered colonial ideas of white, of Englishness, which over time were transformed into these kind of discourses of whiteness.

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To Marilyn Lake has said that colonial whiteness was characterized by requisite qualities rule such as uprightness, integrity, self-discipline and stoicism.

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Characteristics she notes that colonial white men very rarely possessed. And this ideological fiction was constructed in part in opposition to the deviant Anglo-indian.

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You know, the Michaels whose only possible strength integrity and self-discipline came from the drop in their veins.

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So I would finish and I this is a work in progress but I would finish that suggesting that Anglo-indians had a kind of a formative role on the development of whiteness within colonial India and one that does bear closer examination.

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Thank you.

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Very much. And now we go from India to Germany and you a lot please introduce yourself as well. So how do we do this escape?

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And then, next presentations said, hold up. Can we click this? Yeah. Okay, so, my name is, from the University of Copelands in Germany of Copelands in Germany and what I want to present today.

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And what I want to present today are preliminary results from my still ongoing, preliminary results from my still ongoing PhD research.

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So preliminary results from my still ongoing PhD research so any input at the end is highly appreciated. By dissertation, I pursued the question of how the German right wing populist party alternative for Germany I kind of even for dodge and construct, construct belongingness and otherness in public discourse, particularly on

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Twitter, so in the digital space and how they translate these concepts into more or less a consistent narratives, a consistent narratives of different collective identities.

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So nation, folk, or culture. And as a lot of you may know, I will keep this short.

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The FD was founded in 2013 in Germany as a self-releanned anti-Euro party as a reaction to the crisis policy of the European Union.

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However, they very quickly gained a reputation as anti-gender anti-immigration party mostly due to their homophobic racist and even anti-Semitic statements in the public.

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And in the manifesto, which was published in 2,016, they take a very strong pro-natalist stance.

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They take a very strong pro-natalist stance for a nuclear heterosexual stance for a nuclear heterosexual family model and against a general ideology family model and against a general ideology, including any kind of environment.

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And additionally they propose strict anti-immigration and especially anti-Islam legislation which is included in over half of the chapters even if they had nothing to do with immigration or religion.

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Despite this, I found that our pulse and service found that actually there's a relatively high number of voters in those groups they seem to exclude in the party manifesto and even in Parliament they have 7.2% of members with a migrant background and just as comparison the social democrats have or had 9.2% of members

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with in parliament with migrant backgrounds. So pretty close. And since 2,014 several ally groups is what I called them have formed that focus on different minority identities.

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So the first one is called alternative homosexuals. The second one is called juice in the IV and the third one is called and they changed their name all the time and new Germans, migrants in the IfD.

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And, as these groups have been heavily discussed, in the media and in the public as contradictory to these party policies.

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I wanted to see how the IfD so the main party works in those contradictions into their sense of belonging.

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To look at this phenomenon and how it pertains to my question, I decided to conduct a qualitative discourse analysis again of the I've these Twitter presence and I choose Twitter as a medium because the FD knows very well how to kind of harness the platform dynamics, how to gain a very wide reach and especially a high engagement.

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They achieved the highest against engagement of all parties on Twitter and Facebook and Germany.

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Just to outline my approach very briefly, I combined the sociology of knowledge approach to discuss a lenses as a methodological framework kind of with the sampling and analysis techniques of A.

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Tausian grounded theory. And I collected data from 169 accounts that belonged to RFD members.

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Party fractions and the allied groups. For the time between July, 2,015. So the point when it was said that the FD made the job to the right and September, the 2021 so roughly 6 years.

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And from this very large pool of data I then compiled 3 smaller sets of data that centered around the topics that the ally groups claim for themselves.

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So homosexuality, Judaism and a Protestants of otherness. As the third group is not only compiled of microns.

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Form. I analyzed them separately and I'm currently working on the bigger picture. So how do they go together where at the intersections?

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And each data set centered around a crisis narration. That is a fragment of a bigger overarching crisis narrative.

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Which I want to briefly illustrate before then moving on what I advertised as ambivalences and antagonisms.

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Within the motives of belongingness and otherness that this crisis narrative essentially provides.

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So in this narrative and this is probably very well known to most, a powerful state elite consisting of a headogenous group of people for the ID.

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This is the government, party politicians, leftists, feminists, the media and sometimes groups kind of come and go.

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And they are said to act against the will and against the good of the people. By waging a cultural war on the people pushing what they consider a cultural Marxist value, so gender ideology and this is a growth importing migrants that are considered the for another.

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And this foreign other esteemed as culturally incompetible with the what the FD now calls indigenous population of Germany.

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And therefore they are dangerous to the Germans. But especially they say to religious and sexual minorities or those that the FD considers the weakest of the population which are children, the elderly and women.

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And the fear that it's embedded in this crisis narrative. And the proposed endpoint of the crisis that we are moving towards is the great replacement so they adopt this term more and more.

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So, the ultimate death or extinction of the German people, whatever that is.

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Within the crisis, narrative, different collective subject positions are embedded, which I want to try and illustrate.

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And at the core are 2 antagonists. Each with a political representative, so to say. Yeah, so the German people, the FDA claims to represent and the other is supposedly represented and aided in their conquest.

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To extinct Germans by the elite. And for the reconstruction of the Germans I found what I called references or reference frames, frames of reference and the first one is the nation so the Federal Republic of Germany the immediate context of the nation which is Europe and a global frame of reference which is the new thing or what

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I think is the new or surprising thing and that is whiteness. And the basis of all of this is the nuclear heterosexual family which starts to reproduce all of these value systems and the people itself.

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So the first frame of reference is the nation and it's signified by a German basic law which is the placeholder for German Constitution and for many it embodies democratic and liberal values.

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Which is highly associated with a very free way of living and a high quality of life and a certain set of amendments like freedom of opinion equality of the sexes religious freedom the freedom of assembly and the right to protest, a call values they associate with this.

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And this cluster of values especially is often seen as carrying on at tradition of the Human Rights Declaration from 1,789.

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Which in China is often used to signify European values that are based on the Enlightenment and the centering of reason and rationality.

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European years often extended to a self-identification as Western or Occidental and it usually refers to a less localized sense of belonging.

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And the final frame of reference is also not a localized one and it comprises the idea of a global community of white people that are connected by this shared root of their values.

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And within the crisis narrative they are constructed as a community of fate that is at the dawn of their extinction kind of like a new global precariat.

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The antagonist and perpetrator of this crisis as I mentioned before is the foreign other. We just helped by global national elites and they are usually portrayed as Muslim.

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But increasingly in my newer material as African or quote-unquote ducts and dark-skinned so people of color.

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And again, they are deemed as inherently incompatible to the German because the German is supposedly civilized while the other is trapped or supposedly trapped in a barbarian past.

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And they do not have the ability to reason which poses a danger to German society. As you can tell, the democracies that are drawn are riddled with racist language with stereotypes and a continuation of orientalist narratives in othering.

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So this clear antagonism and the nature of the other positioning is very exclusionary but it also enables the inclusion of the allied groups.

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Albeit somewhat paradoxical at times. They too are made out to be under threat from the other even more so than the German people actually.

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As the other is portrayed as deeply homophobic misogynistic and antisemitic.

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So while they are not necessarily included in the German identity. The ally groups, the acceptance of these groups is included into German identity.

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And the Allied groups. Encouraged to protect this German identity and the values tied to it to protect themselves.

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And this is especially true. For the LGBTQ I plus community, we just excluded from the very core of the people.

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It's Jerusalem, the heterosexual nuclear family. And they are excluded from expressing their own values in public spaces.

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So anything to do with bright, they do not want to see. Still, the acceptance of homosexuality as the idea is integral to the identity of an enlightened and civilized German people.

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This however is not seen as paradoxical by the alternative. It's also not seen as paradoxical by the group alternative homosexuals.

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As it creates a limited but legitimized space for homosexual people to occupy, which they call conservative homosexuality.

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In which conservative, especially national values are supposed to be prioritized over LGBTQI plus emancipation and the LGBTQI plus emancipation and their limited access emancipation and their limited access to societal institution is the limited access to societal institution is simply accepted.

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In contrast.

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Jewish people are seen as part of Germany and its values. Which is emphasized through terms like Judeo-christian tradition, Judeo-christian Occident, which I think many have seen also in the video protests.

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And this fusion of Jewish and German identity. Is especially important to the FD because it helps the party separate itself and maybe even Germany as a whole and not only from the demonised Orient But from the Nazi past of ripening politics in Germany.

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Instead, the foreign other is put into a place of continuity or historical continuity and they are called or portrait as being the real Nazi, the new Nazi who is trying to produce precipitate a second Holocaust.

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So this is another big crisis narrative. Now the last group, Migrans, Muslims and POC, seem to be excluded pretty clearly from German identity at first sight, especially because of this new found emphasis on whiteness.

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But again, the idea somehow creates an opening that they can occupy inside. So if they were to denounce the religion, their cultural heritage, and if they were to adopt conservative and national values atating for those values and not for equality or anti-racism they can be welcomed as allies to the Germans by the

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FD but not without making it very clear that they think it's almost impossible for a lot of countries to do this because the culture is supposedly so deeply ingrained it almost becomes genetic.

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So to conclude. The FD uses the crisis narrative they created to manufacture belongings and otherness and both both processes are shaped by a clear antagonism of the German army and the foreign other.

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At the same time, they leave room for ambivalences that are important to safeguard the collective identity of the Germans as civilized, modern and so on.

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And one aspect of this collective identity and why I submitted to this session is the factor of y-plus which was very surprising to me.

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In the clarity in which it was articulated. Of course the notion of whiteness is not new in writing populist discourse or the German right-wing politics.

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And it's very often used in visuals, but the term isn't usually used as in vise design being white as a positive identifier in those bases.

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This novelty might have explain why the group's alternative homosexuals or juice in the IV form because whiteness might just be a primary identifier to them.

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At the same time it magnifies the paradox of POC and non-white immigrants aligning with the party.

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And one explanation might be found and I'm just starting to explore this. And when looking at Gaji Shakawati Speavak's concept of the native informer because the role they are put in with the ally groups is almost the role of the chief witness.

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So to speak there are supposed to justify and they do this why certain minorities are excluded from equal rights for example of certain spaces in society and I do this from a seemingly legitimized position.

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When they say as X Muslims for example yes Muslims are oppressive and violent or as homosexual yes homosexuals are late in pedophiles or when Jewish people say Germans need to move on from the Holocaust.

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It's enough. We can let it go. And in doing so, they themselves take a position of exceptionalism as they are not like the others.

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Thank you.

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Thank you very much. The papers really connected while it's doing what I want to do. Okay, The papers really connected well together.

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So thank you very much. And before we go on to take some questions, I encourage my colleague who might put together this session, he will lead that.

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I just wanted to mention that we have a distributed paper. In Jim, Kim, are you here? Thank you very much for your papers.

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So please read Kim's paper as it's very interesting and it's on. Whiteness in the restaurants of Canal, Samarta neighborhood in Paris.

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I think you presented another patron in another station but we distributed yours this time. Thank you very much.

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So we'll take questions now. Very simple to see is to come up because there's not very many microphones.

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Yes, I can.

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And I hope, I hope Morgan you're still there and you can hear us. So I need a new new share or stop show.

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Sheriff. Hi Morgan, can you hear me?

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Hi, I can, yes.

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Right, okay. Yeah. So as Epex said, 5 really fascinating presentations. Showing how complex it is to create this thing called whiteness which we might take for granted in many ways.

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We've only got about 12 or 13 min. I want to try and invite people to ask questions in clusters.

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I want to try and invite people to ask questions in clusters if that's okay. I mean I could ask things but I'll just call people as I see them.

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So you want to come up first. You need to use the microphone. Partly so Morgan can hear and also for recording purposes.

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If you want to say who you are as well that's fine but presentations today and I have 2 primary questions.

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The first is kind of raw for everyone but primarily open to everyone but primarily for Professor Mcclain.

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I'm wondering how you understand what it means to sort of racialize or racially mark someone as indigenous or racially mark someone as indigenous within your particular context.

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Given that it means to sort of racialize or racially mark someone as indigenous within your particular context, or racially mark someone as indigenous within your particular context.

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Relative questionable ambitious colonial project with them genocide with which it was more important as we all know to kill off natives than to racialize or categorize them specifically in the way that we kind of understand other racial categories.

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So I'm wondering for your context, how do you understand what it means to identify as indigenous or to understand Indigenous as a racial category within your given political and historical context.

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And then my second question is specifically for Mr. Morgan. When you say that whiteness is or rightness or could be acquired within the summit. Is this the right?

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Yeah, waitness can be acquired or it was claimed that what needs to be acquired from your because it's very similar to this.

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What does this really mean within your contest and how do we make sense of the contradiction between racial and self-racial identification and external processes of racialization.

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So I'm thinking particularly in regards to whiteness. For example, if a very dark-skinned brown man with more African features and maybe a little bit of European heritage could identify as white as much as he wants that he's going to be treated by the world as a black man, and in this wayblock has in many ways can be such an

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irrevocable racial category. And so how do we make sense of this in relation to the potential category.

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And so how do we make sense of this in relation to the potential modification of this in relation to the potential modification of by this in relation to the potential modification of by the potential modification of byte range identification of by race identification and what are implications of that.

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Cyclists and we want to pick you. Great, thank you very much. EPEC, I'm just gonna get ask other people because you've already That would be favoritism to ask you.

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I mean just as a PS to the questions this had been asked I wanted to ask or any of the other speakers think about what it might mean to sort of say whiteness is claimed rather than whiteness is acquired or what are the kind of conditions or the conditionalities.

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Around whiteness which is something that all of you are speaking about in a little way but sorry somebody asked it out of their hand up.

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You want to ask? Well, okay. Nobody else. No, no, you go ahead.

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It's it's very good question if panelists ask each other questions and then EPECK if you want to come in as well. My question is Akbar.

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From a movie I think I'm sorry. Because I was really interested to know why the movies is okay with the research because essentially when you do your writing models And I think the conversation and why they are doing this would be really interesting to know.

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Okay, and then we'll take a few questions. EPECK if you want to ask yours and then you can come here you can you're the chair of the session.

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So the police, I want to predict this research market on other professions. So the police, I want to do this research morbid on other professions so I can do this research work on other professions so I can easily imagine for example teachers and so on other professions so I can easily imagine for all other professions so I can easily imagine for example teachers and so on assuming such white identities and so on so I wondered if you

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looked at, for example, teachers and so on, assuming such white identities and so on. So I wondered if you looked at that and whether the police are an uplier or they are part or person of this professionalisation.

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In terms of Chile, I was wondering if the current Vikings from the Caribbean was a ongoing process in today, you know, a boundary.

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So the new migrants, did they change the kind of racial conversation or what could be constructed or something new is being constructed? So it's changed our rainfall.

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In terms of you know, I was wondering if you had, any need that he looked into research on terminal nationalism and also homo nationalism in probably Rome and whether the current process you talked about relates to that.

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I have other questions but I would like to discuss. So, thank you. Yeah, sorry. I'll try and take all the questions at once because otherwise we may run out of time so yeah please come forward.

440
01:22:59.000 --> 01:23:08.000
I don't know if they're really easy to box right now. Other questions? Just like that.

441
01:23:08.000 --> 01:23:14.000
My questions are at the towards with Dr. Martin. My question is around what you see as the Dr. Martin.

442
01:23:14.000 --> 01:23:17.000
My question is around what you see as the, if you could just elaborate what you see as the, if you could just elaborate obviously as a distinction between session of mixed race versus mixed blood.

443
01:23:17.000 --> 01:23:30.000
I really wanted to, I thought I was a really interesting point because I haven't noticed that they Chinese the word that's still used for mixed race is actually being split.

444
01:23:30.000 --> 01:23:35.000
It's pretty good. And so I haven't realized that before and I wanted to speak more of that.

445
01:23:35.000 --> 01:23:53.000
And the other question I had was around this I, what I notice is you talk about the ways in which There's a genderedness to Anglo-indianness in that, Anglo-indian women, or siege as kind of hyperfeminine, and which really reminded me of the ways in

446
01:23:53.000 --> 01:23:59.000
which Asianness more broadly is eminized Calgary for both Asian men and with Asians and Jennifer Knights.

447
01:23:59.000 --> 01:24:14.000
Where that lease of particular hyposexuality have a sexualization of Asian women and then the kind of a point of I guess like the kind of feminizations I've been in as well would be a noise in which the masculine things are unacknowledged.

448
01:24:14.000 --> 01:24:27.000
I wondered what that meant in this class just seen in relation to January categories as well, what does that do to the gender of class?

449
01:24:27.000 --> 01:24:41.000
Okay, because we only have 5 min left, and what does it try and give us? Let's take a lot of questions at once because that gives us speakers a bit of time to wrap up and.

450
01:24:41.000 --> 01:24:56.000
Check questions online. Yeah, it says it's still 2 pm on my thing. So we've got another 20 min.

451
01:24:56.000 --> 01:25:05.000
So we've got another 20 min. Okay, well, sorry. He says, and now you guys help.

452
01:25:05.000 --> 01:25:17.000
Sorry, I apologize. Thank you to all of the presenters and to the organizers for what was a really fascinating session.

453
01:25:17.000 --> 01:25:46.000
I've got a specific question for Katherine Martin. Spin off that little aside really that you made to Marilyn Lake about the, sort of self-imagining of the, the written in India as embodying uprightness and steadfastness and so on and so forth more

454
01:25:46.000 --> 01:25:58.000
very little resemblance to the colonial men. And yeah, I think the masculinity is essential to that as well.

455
01:25:58.000 --> 01:26:09.000
I wonder if that might be there's sauce really the point. The the fact that the real colonizers weren't like that.

456
01:26:09.000 --> 01:26:23.000
Produce the need for them to Iiologically, create an ideology of the mirror image of what they were.

457
01:26:23.000 --> 01:26:46.000
And so I really like the point that you concluded with about the the much parody. Hey, ridicul for his parody or proper British rescue liberty.

458
01:26:46.000 --> 01:27:10.000
It indeed being central to the construction of The image of British was in Antarctica. I wonder if that might be extended to its playing a strong role in the in the construction, the ideological construction of British steadfastness and uprightness in the Empire as a whole.

459
01:27:10.000 --> 01:27:17.000
Okay, well apologies for messing up the time. I'm gonna let Morgan go first and then we'll work.

460
01:27:17.000 --> 01:27:20.000
This way down the table so more wouldn't you want to go first?

461
01:27:20.000 --> 01:27:29.000
Yes, sorry. There was one question that I couldn't. Really get about, it was a second question about why my research, how it was, how it's proceeded by police officers or something like that.

462
01:27:29.000 --> 01:27:34.000
So just that person could

463
01:27:34.000 --> 01:27:42.000
Yeah, I think the question was, put it bluntly, why did the police let you in?

464
01:27:42.000 --> 01:27:43.000
So that was that's a simplification but that's what the essence of it was.

465
01:27:43.000 --> 01:28:10.000
Why did they? About the first question which I understood was a little bit about maybe the contradictions or links between self racial identity and how this racially mixed doctors are externally pursued.

466
01:28:10.000 --> 01:28:11.000
!

467
01:28:11.000 --> 01:28:12.000
I think there's There's an interesting paradox, which is the fact that, well, on one side is officers who have this degree of racial and beauty within them and maybe some physical aspect that relate to blackness and not others.

468
01:28:12.000 --> 01:28:36.000
Well, it's always or very frequently seen with suspicion if they identify as black. So it's seen like maybe maybe as someone who who might criticize the institution but paradoxically on the other side will these racially abused officers they don't cease to to suffer also internal racial discrimination from officers.

469
01:28:36.000 --> 01:29:00.000
Other peer officers often white and although they they don't most of them do not a larger variety of them do not talk about racial discrimination they they were very convinced for the majority of them that that there's no such thing, but I've observed, things in my demographic work that, you know, seem to

470
01:29:00.000 --> 01:29:08.000
be racial discrimination. So there's, I think there's this, interesting thing between how you think of yourself and what you perceive.

471
01:29:08.000 --> 01:29:15.000
And I think there's an interesting article in also talking about Brazil that talks about that about the fact that people in Brazil.

472
01:29:15.000 --> 01:29:39.000
Identifying as mixed race and not pursuing racial discrimination when they start talking about racial discrimination or settings in which they see some forms of racism they start to shift their racial identity saying yeah okay I'm mistreased but maybe I'm also in certain cases that so there is this link between when racial discrimination is preceded how you define

473
01:29:39.000 --> 01:29:46.000
yourself and I kind of see that in my in my research. So that's for the first the first question.

474
01:29:46.000 --> 01:29:51.000
Why did they let me in? I think that's, that's a really interesting question.

475
01:29:51.000 --> 01:29:58.000
It's been a really hard process of access that I've worked on for a year to get.

476
01:29:58.000 --> 01:30:17.000
This axis and I think I think the main reason is because I am French. What European and as I was mentioning in my research, Songpal was military police has very a very high perception of.

477
01:30:17.000 --> 01:30:32.000
A few repeat of your PNIT and Europeanness and and they have also French origins in their, in their, in the construction of the institution.

478
01:30:32.000 --> 01:30:54.000
And so when I said I was French and I was doing some comparative work between these 2 police they were actually quite flattered and and I know that for Brazilian scholars working on race or police or both it's been practically impossible for them to have access but me coming from this perspective saying I'm conducting comparative research on

479
01:30:54.000 --> 01:31:09.000
police in France and in Brazil. Has granted me this access. And the way I talked about race was, I mean, there's a lot of ethical questions to discuss there, but I do not know.

480
01:31:09.000 --> 01:31:16.000
There's a lot of ethical questions to discuss there, but I do not mention specifically that my research is on whiteness.

481
01:31:16.000 --> 01:31:22.000
I mentioned that I'm doing work on different topics comparatively which include racial identity. But yeah, so that's the kind of narrative.

482
01:31:22.000 --> 01:31:33.000
And then, and then finally research on other contexts relating to that. And I'm sure there must be things, around a bureaucracy, specifically street level bureaucrats.

483
01:31:33.000 --> 01:31:57.000
I know there is a few research in France talking about how bureaucrats and specifically coming from a minority group in France made up certain narratives to be accepted by their white colleagues so that something that yeah maybe there's something to look at to look at there but I think I think there's something specific about being police

484
01:31:57.000 --> 01:32:08.000
and what. What constructing a police identity does to someone that That is very specific to police and that's what I'm trying to explore.

485
01:32:08.000 --> 01:32:10.000
So yeah. That's cool.

486
01:32:10.000 --> 01:32:20.000
Thank you. Actually, Martine of Bose is online, so she might want to come in later on about street and about bureaucrats because it's online so she might want to come in later on about street and about bureaucrats because it's her area of about street and about bureaucrats because

487
01:32:20.000 --> 01:32:26.000
it's her area of expertise and I also saw if I haven't mixed you up. I think you presented a really fantastic paper about police violence in Brazil in some other session.

488
01:32:26.000 --> 01:32:32.000
Zapina, okay, sorry, I'm mixing you up with somebody else. Okay, we're gonna go right to left and take the money at the time.

489
01:32:32.000 --> 01:32:56.000
Thank you for the question, which is a question I was afraid of. Because 3 functionalism and homonationalism are actually very important concepts that I started with, especially because at the beginning I looked at the individuals who are actually very important concepts that I started with, especially because at the beginning I looked at the individuals in the groups and we even come

490
01:32:56.000 --> 01:33:05.000
back to the few interviews but I moved more to the perspective of what spaces does the main part you create because trying to to reproduce the reasonings of the individuals.

491
01:33:05.000 --> 01:33:15.000
I kind of like I didn't want to be in a position to say whether good Homosexual should vote left.

492
01:33:15.000 --> 01:33:41.000
So. Like there were a lot of concerns that were coming up and in this part so I kind of put this aside and moved more to the spaces that the idea creates and I think that For this, I don't think the concepts are in that yet, but I keep moving from my data to those theoretical concepts to see where can I add

493
01:33:41.000 --> 01:33:54.000
something is maybe there will shift where my research question moves in a different direction. And also what I'm trying to understand is the overarching logic.

494
01:33:54.000 --> 01:34:09.000
And this is why I chose all of the 3 groups. When these concepts intersect, so when I was a very interesting question is because I keep moving back and forth and I haven't really

495
01:34:09.000 --> 01:34:17.000
Yeah, probably my place in those concepts yet, but they are very important to kind of constantly reform in my research.

496
01:34:17.000 --> 01:34:24.000
But at this point, and which is why I said it was welcome, I spent a lot of time now with my later.

497
01:34:24.000 --> 01:34:40.000
And I'm now moving again slowly into the direction of existing theoretical concept. My data so Yeah, I don't think I can give you a good answer to this.

498
01:34:40.000 --> 01:34:46.000
One section. I think from what you were saying, it would be quite useful to bring out the frameworks.

499
01:34:46.000 --> 01:34:51.000
Thank you.

500
01:34:51.000 --> 01:34:56.000
Okay. Okay. So mixed race versus makes love.

501
01:34:56.000 --> 01:35:03.000
I mean that's they are the same thing so I think this is the whole point that race comes to be signified by life.

502
01:35:03.000 --> 01:35:09.000
I am really short sighted who asked the question. You were smudging me. I'm sorry.

503
01:35:09.000 --> 01:35:38.000
So, so blood becomes the signifier. So life becomes the signifier. And we know that works in different ways in different kind of colonial contexts, but in India it because there was this mix of this and it also starts to then we get this kind of slippage.

504
01:35:38.000 --> 01:35:53.000
But life becomes a sign of it. It becomes the way in which race become configured and that's where so you can be wiped you can dress like a white person you can eat English food which I'm going into but you're still not black because you don't have that blood.

505
01:35:53.000 --> 01:35:59.000
And in terms of the gentleness, I think it's really interesting because they are gender, they are absolutely hypersexualized.

506
01:35:59.000 --> 01:36:13.000
And Anglo, Nessie was very beautiful, very sexual, but they're also seen as quite aggressive, quite pushy, they've got short voices, they're quite loud, they're out to get a man, which kind of contrasts with how Asian women certainly were seen as kind of quite passive within these contexts.

507
01:36:13.000 --> 01:36:24.000
But it's quite classed. It's almost like this kind of class climbing you know social climbing attitude so we see these kind of intersections between class and race in that context.

508
01:36:24.000 --> 01:36:36.000
I think it's an area I want to look into a little bit more. The impact that had on the ideas of the white woman that developed in that context.

509
01:36:36.000 --> 01:36:52.000
And this idea of the self-imagining of the British in in India. It is absolutely this ideological fiction and I, the extent to which it can be kind of extrapolated to the empire as a whole.

510
01:36:52.000 --> 01:36:57.000
Where whiteness is kind of the English whiteness which really does, I mean we know that wines develop in different ways and in different contexts.

511
01:36:57.000 --> 01:37:09.000
We know that from looking at specific contexts but there is also this kind of discourse of whiteness that kind of emanates out from Britain and that I think is forged in.

512
01:37:09.000 --> 01:37:15.000
In the Indian Empire. So I do, I do think that does. It said that. I do absolutely think that does.

513
01:37:15.000 --> 01:37:28.000
And just in answer to your question, the extent to which Whiteness is claimed. I think with angry news it is denied by the British, so they're described as parasites but it is claimed by ongoing meat.

514
01:37:28.000 --> 01:37:35.000
So even if they've got brown skin, they they claim that leap to whiteness because of because of blood even though it's the love that it's denying.

515
01:37:35.000 --> 01:37:43.000
So it's kind of this claim done denied at the same time. Good. Thanks. Next one my great question.

516
01:37:43.000 --> 01:37:55.000
And, they are difficult as well. I'm trying to answer them. So the first person to ask what would it mean understanding eating as a spectator, right?

517
01:37:55.000 --> 01:38:25.000
And, and I think, okay, what, meeting like the You need to, communities like they have an ongoing struggle with the state until now okay like they haven't been recognized in the Constitution, which was why now with the new one session we had the the idea of, or maybe wish for thinking that they would be recognized at least because

518
01:38:26.000 --> 01:38:34.000
there are some loss of course but they would be recognized at least because there are some loss of course but they were in the end because there are some laws of course but they they were in the constitutions or now so there you can see how neglected.

519
01:38:34.000 --> 01:38:51.000
Part of the history was, they even know in the national narratives, we know that Tina people were like the mix between indigenous axis freeze right? They were like the mix between indigenous as as Greece, right?

520
01:38:51.000 --> 01:39:00.000
And just people with Spanish colonisers. But that's interesting because, er, in the textbooks, for example, when I, in the school.

521
01:39:00.000 --> 01:39:30.000
We thought that there were no people of African descent. You know, that all died because of the weather because of the cold weather you know and another thing and then the Afro Tina movement And I like, you know, in the in the 2 thousands, you know, because they they also had to meet like the grandmother because I also in my in my daughter at least

522
01:39:32.000 --> 01:39:42.000
II also researched this after a movement movement because I think the way TM treats migrants.

523
01:39:42.000 --> 01:39:50.000
You know, coincides with the way you know indigenous communities and African descent communities were were treated you know in today.

524
01:39:50.000 --> 01:39:57.000
And so you have the colonial reminiscence. You know, and the thing is that the great government is actually rejecting the heterogeneous character of the China society.

525
01:39:57.000 --> 01:40:19.000
In fact that we are a homogeneous society and that this mixing in a implies that the indigenous element was installed.

526
01:40:19.000 --> 01:40:39.000
You know, we get this Spanish European thing. And you can see at the state level this like this this national It was a project.

527
01:40:39.000 --> 01:40:48.000
You know, there was a raptor. Because this happened along all Latin America, not only in China.

528
01:40:48.000 --> 01:40:57.000
So, now, nowadays also,igenous people are as being as inferior, you know, in Latin America, not only in Chile.

529
01:40:57.000 --> 01:41:20.000
So, now, nowadays also indigenous peoples are as being as inferior, you know, and the way they protect their lands, for example, or these things, they are not, they are seen as Lexi and other attributes Actually, maybe answer also the your question currently that that's why white myth it becomes

530
01:41:20.000 --> 01:41:38.000
to be claimed. In here today with the presence of migrants that share a similar answer to it. And this is why I thought it was interesting to study like the TNTs as an example, because as an example of a multimeter context where people convert and have this thing with similar ancestries, right?

531
01:41:38.000 --> 01:41:48.000
But then whiteness since they are all working class. And you know, it race matter the most.

532
01:41:48.000 --> 01:42:05.000
And that was really interesting because II really wanted to see I actually was based I lived there for my university work for a year and a half and I and I can see that these these kind of things were not and now I cannot answer your question.

533
01:42:05.000 --> 01:42:21.000
These things were not really explicitly claimed before, but like there was like when I was taking for granted and what is interesting is that even my friends when we went to study abroad.

534
01:42:21.000 --> 01:42:44.000
And what is interesting is that even my friends when we went to study abroad for instance made me realise oh I'm not right you know people say I'm not going to study abroad for instance made me realise, for instance, may realize, oh, like I'm not white, you know, people say I'm not

535
01:42:44.000 --> 01:42:55.000
white, you know, people say I'm not white, you know, people say I'm not white or I'm white you know I have a friend that even in the UK you know when in the for the visa they put white or even in the UK you know when when in the for for the visa they put white or other widespread they put white or other white you know

536
01:42:55.000 --> 01:42:58.000
I never put that because I knew that I was other because I knew II knew that I was other than Nepal.

537
01:42:58.000 --> 01:43:14.000
Because there was no that It also happens that the people for example and marrying someone from Europe from Europe for example they said oh no I'm doing the race And that's a typical thing that you still listen, you know, on this day.

538
01:43:14.000 --> 01:43:21.000
So it's really too interesting. So, so I think a White House also like it's great.

539
01:43:21.000 --> 01:43:48.000
A a process even you know but the things that I think and the like really finding themselves as a Russian identity was more what was clearer in this background I actually want to study what happens in another like in the middle class you know and and other classes across children because I think it will be different the way they define themselves.

540
01:43:48.000 --> 01:44:00.000
But still, I think, er, it is like in a normal class neighborhood at least, they were like, You mentioned that you are a student.

541
01:44:00.000 --> 01:44:08.000
They felt as behind at the government where they have a struggle for resources. So now they can say, OK, I have more rights than these migrants.

542
01:44:08.000 --> 01:44:16.000
Or they said that on the narrative behind that was, okay, I am superior and wider. So I have more rights.

543
01:44:16.000 --> 01:44:21.000
You know, I am superior. I'm better. That's why people come here and there was that again.

544
01:44:21.000 --> 01:44:30.000
Why do you think we are not the best? You know, so there's all these narratives and also there are all these narratives and also there are many things that they have.

545
01:44:30.000 --> 01:44:34.000
And also there are like many things that they have. And also there are many things that they have, like they say that like to the English in Latin America, for instance.

546
01:44:34.000 --> 01:44:41.000
So it's hard, yeah, like, oh, this, this all kind of like traces, you know, that they are.

547
01:44:41.000 --> 01:44:50.000
So it is interesting. And I think it wasn't, and another question, what was an ongoing process?

548
01:44:50.000 --> 01:44:56.000
You know, there is whiteness. I think yes and at the same level in whack with the with the raspberries of Matthew Staffin with the Raspberry Pi.

549
01:44:56.000 --> 01:45:08.000
And I think, but the interesting thing is that now you can see the interesting thing is that now you can see at the local level how they were produced.

550
01:45:08.000 --> 01:45:13.000
Against the state's peace groups. You know? And I think, I also want to advice like the migratory policies you know when we begin with right wing ex-presidents and the conversation was stronger.

551
01:45:13.000 --> 01:45:31.000
You know, but with right wing ex presidents, and the conversation was stronger. You know, like people were like, OK, they made a difference.

552
01:45:31.000 --> 01:45:48.000
There were different kind of visas for For Venezuela, it was called democratic. A visa so like oh you can come you know your your motto and for Hitens what was the humanitarian peace.

553
01:45:48.000 --> 01:45:56.000
And they only welcome the families of the people that were already here there. So they closed quarters. 100 people.

554
01:45:56.000 --> 01:46:19.000
So you could see me and I think that was the thing of my favourite that you could see the change between one government with VATER government and then PNS government, how it takes the conversation and now where a group that was most Hey, yeah, and what what it's interesting as well is that For me at least I thought

555
01:46:19.000 --> 01:46:38.000
always like the artist that racing was like predominant but anytime I talk to a team and participants and they always bring, bring out like against even though Permits have lived there for 20 years, 30 years.

556
01:46:38.000 --> 01:46:46.000
And they still haven't been, you know, able to, to be there, like to have the rights to be there, you know.

557
01:46:46.000 --> 01:46:58.000
And so I think that's why he was an indigenous strategy, you know, that the gaining of whiteness had to do with that and in in line with the state.

558
01:46:58.000 --> 01:47:05.000
Thanks. Thank you.

559
01:47:05.000 --> 01:47:06.000
And I'll try to briefly fetch a one to answer a question on claiming or acquiring kind of thing.

560
01:47:06.000 --> 01:47:22.000
Can I just interrupt you for a second because Martina had a question in the chat which disappear but she was just asking you to talk a bit more about generations as well the impact of generations alongside race and class.

561
01:47:22.000 --> 01:47:31.000
Sorry to throw that at you, but it was very strong. Oh, okay. I'll see if I can.

562
01:47:31.000 --> 01:47:34.000
And Martin, if you unmute yourself, you might be able to speak.

563
01:47:34.000 --> 01:47:37.000
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Sorry, I mean that. Can you hear me?

564
01:47:37.000 --> 01:47:43.000
Okay, so we'll just quickly take this comment. Thanks.

565
01:47:43.000 --> 01:47:44.000
Yep, everything we.

566
01:47:44.000 --> 01:47:46.000
If you can hear me. So probably I mean, I really need. That's great. Thank you.

567
01:47:46.000 --> 01:48:00.000
I really need to read or I'm looking forward to reading your papers. So my question is really, so when I ask about age and generation, it's really about So it's obviously a central dimension of the visualization is to do with accent and language.

568
01:48:00.000 --> 01:48:15.000
And I just wonder whether. So I'm curious how you guys with that in the paper in your papers because, this is a kind of dimension of rice, or a racialized, racializability that can change over time.

569
01:48:15.000 --> 01:48:22.000
And hence my question high is that for the second generation, how's it for the second generation, Eastern Europeans in in the UK.

570
01:48:22.000 --> 01:48:30.000
So yeah, so the question is really about the role of language and accent in that in your theorization of race and racialization. I hope that makes sense.

571
01:48:30.000 --> 01:48:31.000
Thanks.

572
01:48:31.000 --> 01:48:45.000
It makes us an lecture about which I was trying to go to. So when you talk about whineness but also class vitamin D and you'd see more something than any quaint rather than acquired.

573
01:48:45.000 --> 01:48:54.000
But then when you talk about acquisition you can ask why who. So I'm certain conditions and hear exactly, like can it be acquired for you or for your children?

574
01:48:54.000 --> 01:49:02.000
And our research, I did not have the science, but we're starting down the fall of those ingredients, also when they were mobile themselves.

575
01:49:02.000 --> 01:49:13.000
There were 2 cases where they were 1.5 generation children. So in those instances they felt more British but still they didn't feel they could fully play the of the bridge.

576
01:49:13.000 --> 01:49:19.000
So how it passes on in the other generation. It's a second question that you could ask later on.

577
01:49:19.000 --> 01:49:26.000
But what happens now, I see it as an aspiration. And also as a way to resist.

578
01:49:26.000 --> 01:49:36.000
So you want to, like especially with this 1.5 in-generation concept, yes, I'm British or I'm more British than I am, but would they see I'm fully British?

579
01:49:36.000 --> 01:49:45.000
Or yes, I'm middle class but could be honest. But need to publish it from Destiny and these kind of Ask the thoughts as still coming in in artists.

580
01:49:45.000 --> 01:49:56.000
So is it whether you aspire to be quite British middle class only resist. Be in place to not white or not so white or Eastern or even a foreign labor market is still in negotiation.

581
01:49:56.000 --> 01:50:12.000
So for those migrants if you do research, it's never quite just aspire. And the point about, Martin has questioned about sort of language accent and so on.

582
01:50:12.000 --> 01:50:33.000
So the language access that's what transpires when you have those who are not by themselves. So one of my generation, they handle the accents better than 1.5 but you don't have those who will raise more rates in the UK so I kind of talk about language in a second generation because Yeah, and apologies for my time

583
01:50:33.000 --> 01:50:40.000
mix up because if I'd done it better we might actually have a second round of questions but one really fascinating aspect about language is also linking to the Angloian, it was actually people renaming themselves.

584
01:50:40.000 --> 01:50:55.000
It's very interesting when you're on your informal is called RICHARD spelled in the Polish right but you pronounce it Richard and it's very fascinating about how your name might be spelled and how it might be spoken in English English.

585
01:50:55.000 --> 01:51:08.000
But, as I said, apologies for my slight, more than slight confusion about the timing and also I just thanks Morgan because I think it's the middle of the night wherever she is I'm not sure that she's in Britain or Brazil.

586
01:51:08.000 --> 01:51:09.000
But thank you for taking part.

587
01:51:09.000 --> 01:51:10.000
How do you do? One year.

588
01:51:10.000 --> 01:51:17.000
Thank you all for attending. And also for 5 fantastic papers and please feel free to talk to the speakers after you've got more questions.

589
01:51:17.000 --> 01:51:22.000
Thank you very much.