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okay. Okay. Okay, okay, yes. Okay. Okay. It's okay. Just for this one. So long time it, yeah. Okay, let's start.

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Hello! Good morning, France! You welcome to our session.

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First of all, I would like to welcome you in the morning and read our acknowledgment of the country

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on behalf of everyone gathered. I pay respect to the split of country here in Nam, where we are meeting, I acknowledged the past and present cooling nation and ruin with Voyeur as the sovereignity people. Here the cultural knowledge holders who maintain and promote the norm aboriginal law, customs, and custody of the responsibilities for the

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and the people. That country continues to sustain generation after generation

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into the future. For all of us

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I recognize the important contributions that first nations thinkers have made to the sociology, including the challenges to our dominant ways of thinking. We thank all the first nations delegates in the room today for their contributions to knowledge in the discipline.

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Thank you for coming our session.

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and we will be sharing the session chair in the session with my colleague, esteemed colleague Patricia from a social cybernetics research group.

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We are joint group today, and we will hoping to have nice meeting today all together, and we have presenters. but first of all, I would like to give the word to Patricia, because they are our hosts.

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please.

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Well, thank you, and welcome, and good morning to everyone and hello to those who are connected back home.

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Just to say that this is a joint session between the Orc working on childhood, where where I ignor is working, and maybe some of you are related and we've she is also a member of the R. C. 51, which is system thinking is a system theory. And we like to explore. We do this in particular, deeper conferences

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to explore these these linkages this way that we can apply system thinking system, theory, reflexivity, feed, feed, feedback all those concepts that are core in our theoretical framework. So we welcome you to keep the conversation after the after the presentations. We will pay a lot of attention on your proposal to to see how come, build up and and strain those connections with

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With your topics, which are clearly a key for the times coming. So I will welcome the first presenter, which I think is, is you okay?

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Welcome, and come on. Come along. Yes, please.

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So so, Baker Baker. Yes, on a structure agency and risk. How does a background of care affects regularly transitions? Welcome? And we we don't know if all the presenters will show up. So you are 6, but now you are 3 any moment, so if you don't mind, we will keep all the the order of a 1515 min exposition. Yes, okay. And then you may still have it more time afterwards with your scan.

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Thank you so much for coming. It is lovely to be here today. I'm going to be speaking to you about a project that I've been running since 2,021 at the University of York in the Uk.

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And I'm going to delve more into findings today around structure, agency and risk and care experience graduate transitions. So before I go any further.

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Joey's care experienced. What do I mean when I say care? Experienced people. So in the yeah, U. K. Care. Experienced people are those who have spent any length of time in state care as children, so this could be in foster care. It could be in a Children's Home to a residential home. It could be looked after at home, which is where the child remains with the birth family, but has social work, intervention.

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or it could be living with friends and relatives in kinship, care

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now to make things a little bit complicated in the Uk. In policy it will often say, care levers, and not care. Experience and care leavers is a legal definition, and what this refers to is those who have spent 3 months or more in care since the age of 14, and her Stewart is still in care at the age of 16, so I know that sounds a little bit like a riddle. It can be hard to get your head around.

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but when I say care experienced, I refer to both those who meet that very strict legal definition, but also those who fall just outside of that. So any of those that have had experiences on that list, so they may have been in and out of care throughout their lives. But don't quite meet that legal definition of care lever.

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So the research that I'm drawing on today is a British Academy-funded project. It's my post-doctoral fellowship that I'm undertaking.

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It's a qualitative, longitudinal narrative inquiry. I'm very interested in stories, and I'm very interested in seeing about how experiences unfold over time.

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So I follow a group of care experienced people from their final year at University. This is both in England and Scotland.

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So that was phase one which I completed last year. Then I revisit them 6 months after graduation, to see where they are at and what their experiences have been like so far. That was phase 2, which I completed in February.

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and then 12 months after graduation, I also revisit them, and that's phase 3, which I will be doing about a week after I return from Australia.

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and so I have 18 participants who I keep revisiting, and I released a phase one report last year which is publicly available. If you just Google, my name, Zoe Baker and care experience graduates, it will pop up, and that's the front cover there. So you know, you've got to the right place. I'm currently writing a phase, 2 report, and then there'll be a phase 3. Report, probably at the early 2024.

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So, to touch on my conceptual framework. We are at a sociology conference after all. I use Margaret Archer's notion of reflexivity. So I'm interested in how participants graduate projects. So their goals and aims are structurally enabled or constrained by their social circumstances, context, and histories. So I'm interested to know what care experience graduates care about what's meaningful to them?

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What is the role of agency in those journeys? And where does structure trump agency, and what I mean by that is, when is agency, not enough to get to where they need to go, and they can't possibly negotiate the structural constraints that I faced. And I published a paper on that in 2,019 which is referenced there about how structure can trump agency based on some previous research. But I'm also combining this with a life course, perspective. Because I was really interested in how does

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care experienced people's own care, background, effect? What structural constraints and enablements they face? So how does their graduate transitions differ to that of a non-care, experienced person.

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So I'm going to show just a few of the key findings from phase one and phase 2 of this project to show these issues of structure, agency and risk in care. Experience graduates, transitions into the world of work are also into postgraduate study.

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So one of the most prominent themes was what we call the Care Cliff Edge.

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When these care, experienced students were coming up to graduation, they faced a reduction or complete loss of support from their local authority. So in the Uk local authorities in England are responsible for care. Experienced people up until the age of 25, and in Scotland it's 26. However, what I found was local authorities were saying to them, now cutting them off well before the age of 25,

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saying, Well, you've got a degree now. They were kind of viewed as doing Ok, we don't have enough money or resource to continue giving you some support

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understandably the end of higher education marked a lot of support as well. So not only did they lose support from the local authority, it was also oops, sorry also from the Higher Education Institution. That was because I haven't had my second coffee this morning.

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So

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higher education institutions in England and Scotland actually provide a lot of support for care. Experienced people. It has really improved over the last 10 years. They get generous financial bursaries, they provide discounted or free accommodation all year round for care, experience, people. But of course, when they come to graduate that falls away as well.

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And finally, there is a lot of support networks that they have created in higher education. So peers from their course also relationships with support staff in their institutions. So there's a lot of loss of safety nets here

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and tied into this cliff edge is the graduate what I've called the graduate to employment gap.

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So for care experienced people, there is no opportunity to undergo what we call boomerango Yo-yo transitions, where a lot of graduates that have a family home would leave the family home. Sorry would leave university and return to live with, say, Mom and dad while they found a job. But that's often not an option for care experienced people. So there is not this family safety net there.

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We're also in a cost of living crisis in the Uk. And this was mentioned repeatedly by participants. How am I going to afford my bills. How am I going to afford my rent?

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There was also issues with accessing and affording housing. and this was due to a few key factors.

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The first was not having a guarantor. So for some context, the guarantor is someone who can sign for you as the sort of insurance when signing a rental agreement of if this person does not manage to pay their rent, I will pay it for them. That's typically a parent, of course, without parental safety nets there, there's no one to sign for them.

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There was also a tension between needing an income for a house, but also needing a safe base to them, find a job from. It's very difficult to find a job when you are homeless

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and finally, social housing for those who were eligible for social housing often required relocation to their local authority area, so to the area where they initially went into care. Of course this was problematic for many people as they developed communities in their university towns and cities.

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and also, as one participant put it, quite well. I have a lot of trauma attached to where I went into care, and I don't want to willingly return there

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in phase 2. When I revisited participants 6 months after graduation, there was some cases where people had fallen off of that cliff edge, and what I'm showing on the screen is an account from one of my participants, dearer.

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who explained that she was homeless for 8 days after she left University.

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and when I say homeless, I mean on the streets, homeless. She was sleeping on park benches. She was bus hopping to stay warm. She was going to the police station to stay there.

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so the consequences of not having these safety nets in place of them falling away when they face the care cliff edge has quite dire consequences for them.

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And these are young people that have got a degree. They've achieved very highly, just like non-care experienced people have, but they just don't have that family safety net.

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And finally, when it comes to risk, of course, without those safety nets there

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the transition out of university becomes incredibly risky for care experienced people.

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So some of the literature I've cited here. stone. Natal was from the British Household panel survey, and they found that completing higher education is one of the strongest determinants of returning to the parental home. What happens when that parental home is not there.

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and Penelope, which is one of the participants that I'm quoting here articulated this quite well. They can go home to their parents. I can't just try something and it fail if it fails. That's my life. That's my home. There's that risk. I don't have people to fall back on.

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So this is a very risky transition, with safety nets provided by the State provided by higher education, institutions falling away when they graduate.

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just to bring in the more conceptual side of this before I wrap up onto my final slide.

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And, as I said, I'm using Margaret Archer's reflexivity, and the post-graduation period was seen as an inevitable period of instability where the participants main concern was to meet their basic needs. I need a job. Any job. It doesn't matter if it's a graduate or professional job. I just need to afford to eat and keep a roof over my head.

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So it was a perceived period of survival reflexivity, and what I mean by that is, if you are just concerned with your own survival, it reduces a scope for agency. It reduces the psychological space to have those internal conversations to work out what is meaningful to me. What personal projects do I want to pursue?

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It's very hard to do that when you don't have your basic needs met.

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So what would help this? I've presented a series of issues here.

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But I like to also talk about what could potentially help this situation. What can help increase the enablements for care experienced graduates?

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So in the phase, one report, I made over 50 recommendations which I'm not going to, you'd be happy to know I'm not just going to sit and read those off here, but I just want to touch on a few key ones. The first one was graduation bursaries.

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Now a few universities in the Uk do already provide these, but it's quite rare for them to do so. Where, if a care experienced person gets to the end of their degree, they give them a lump sum which can then cover their rent for the first few months of them leaving university while they find a job. So it provides that safety net and reduces that period of survival, reflexivity.

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communication. Sorry, a continuation of communication and contact from the local authority was seen as very beneficial. So they could be made aware of. Okay, you might not be eligible for this and that support anymore. But you can also apply for this support and this support.

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Guarantor schemes from the local authority were seen as beneficial. Again, not many do this, but I did find a couple in the Uk. Who had done this successfully where the local authorities, so the State act as a guarantor when care experienced people are applying for rented accommodation.

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and finally, higher education. Facilitated employment was seen as very beneficial for reducing that period of survival reflexivity, so either a continuation of work placements that they had done during their degree course where they'd said, You know what? Okay? You can have a job when you finish your degree or the university offering paid. I want to stress that paid summer internships for when they finished

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that degree. So I'm going to wrap up there. Thank you so much for listening. I do have some further reading here from my past research and the current research and references. If you want to receive these, please just get in touch. Ask me. I'm more than happy to share these.

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Thank you so much.

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Good luck.

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Thank you. Ze. It's a very interesting paper you presented to us. Is there anybody who would like to ask questions to her, or shall we sum it up at the end? Yeah, yeah, yes. Could you please introduce yourself and ask a question.

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maybe. Can I start keeping the time? Thank you. Oh, great! I'm happy. I kept the time.

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Could you introduce yourself. Yeah. So Hello, everyone. I'm Jao Shi. I'm a Phd candidate in sociology from the University of Queensland, Australia.

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sorry. Your name is Zoe. Right? It is. Yeah. So I sorry I missed the first half of the presentation, because there's a bit hassle to find this place. So I'm wondering in terms of how does the higher education sector respond to these recommendations you're making, especially when it comes to paid internships and the continuation support? I'm not too familiar with the higher education structure in the Uk. But

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in Australia the higher education sector is going through a very it's going on neoliberal highway, as I call it.

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and there's a strong reluctance of change in that sector in terms of providing very support and more

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care for the students, even during their candidate, or even during their study. So I'm wondering, how do they respond to these recommendations, and what are some of the possible trajectory that they can change? That's a really good question. Thank you so much. So when you mentioned that universities in Australia on a neoliberal highway, we are well down that highway in the Uk.

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It's been increasing since the 19 nineties, and very dramatically so in the past 10 years. However, what's different to that reluctance to change is that universities have responded very positively to my recommendations.

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and many of them are very keen to do as much as they possibly can within financial reason, with their resources to help care experienced people. So I have disseminated my recommendations far and wide to universities, to local authorities, to policymakers. Anyone who will listen and read them.

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and universities have been the ones that have responded most positively and have willingly approached me for conversations on how can we feasibly implement this? So they already have quite strong support structures in place, and they were continuously looking for ways they can increase that care, experience graduates. And are these recommendations echoed by local authorities? And

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no, so I did direct a series of the recommendations to local authorities as well, but they are under

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more financial restrictions than university. They are dramatically underfunded by the government, and they've been crying out for more funding for years. And so it's not really. We can't really point the blame at the local authority, and I'm always clear on that. In the recommendations. It's the department for education in the Uk. Which provides that funding needs to increase that funding, and because they are so constrained in what they can do, which is why we see them prematurely cutting off support to care experienced people.

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Thank you. You're welcome.

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Oh, is a question that that trick

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I don't know which one of us was. First this on

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quite quiet.

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Thank you for that. Sorry. So you. You presented your your opposition of structure and agency, and your recommendations were pointing more towards the structural than the agentic end of that spectrum. Yes,

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And and they were pointed more at that structural level, so recommendations to institutions, etc. So I just wondered if, coming out of the research, there was more at the at the

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individual agency level in terms of what you found that the graduates could do. Some of those examples of

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where there might have been some successes where they were really pushing against those intense structural barriers.

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Yes. So the reason that the recommendations are very focused on structure is, that's what I found that needed to change the most. The care experience graduates were very determined. They had overcome a lot of issues just to enter higher education, higher education, anyway. and then successfully get to the end. As a lot of those who do make it higher education drop out. So I'm speaking to quite a small, very successful group. And

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they were basically coming up against a lot of these constraints which were then closing down their opportunity to make choices. And they became restricted decisions as to what they could do. So rather than Oh, I came to university wanting to enter the health care profession, or I wanted to do this and that in the other. It then became closed down by these structural constraints of.

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I'm just going to take any job so that I can get an income to live. So I'm going to stack shelves, work in a bar. And what have you? And this was completely due to those structural constraints. It wasn't an intrinsic agency-driven choice. It was a decision they had had to make for their own survival.

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It is yeah. Sociology is very depressing. We will have to meet up some time.

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Yeah.

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you have to hold it quite close. It's just a lot quieter than the main mind, but if you hold it close I can hear it on the zoom.

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Yeah, yeah, thank you very much for the wonderful presentation I was also just reflecting on. You know, I've lint a lot. And I just looking at what happens, I think, with among us the graduates. I was also reflecting on what happens in my country, and I'm going in Africa. So I've learned a lot. But I was just a maybe just a a comment, or maybe just something that I I would like to find out like that being the Uk. I I know. Maybe it's me

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from the mixed economy point of view. Maybe I was just looking at the response. I've seen the local authorities playing a kilo. But I would want like to find out how. Maybe the response from the other sectors, for instance, the

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the private you know. on the non profit of organizations as well as the private sector in terms of maybe addressing the the issue. Maybe it's instead of just maybe, is it just the government? But what about

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the non-profit organizations as well as the private sector?

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So with third sector, for instance, when I said earlier to the earlier question, that universities have been very willing to change and put things in place. The third sector have also been just as engaged as universities

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in terms of private sector. So I have been trying to get my recommendations out to private sector employers, because obviously graduates moving into employment. I had a lot of recommendation for employers to make things more accessible for care, experienced people

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that has been more tricky. But I have been having discussions with. We have a care, lever covenant in the Uk, which is hosted by the Department for Education, which communicates with employers and has them ring fence opportunities for care experienced people. So I've been in discussion with them on how they can get employers to actually look at the recommendations and see what they can implement. So not yet, but hopefully.

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hopefully, in a year's time I can say yes. Employers have responded positively and are doing X, y, and Z.

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Maybe just a a short one. Maybe I was just also looking at having interest in the gender dimensions in the experiences of those graduates. Maybe. What? How has been your experience in terms of the gender differences

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in the experiences of those graduates!

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That's that's a very good question, because well, what I've been really finding is that that care, experienced background is overriding other forms of inequality and other forms of characteristics. So nothing to do with gender has really stood out. To me it has been care, experienced background, and the circumstances arising from that that has been the key sort of factor in the opportunities and structural constraints that they've faced.

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Thank you very much.

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Here I can. I can use this one. You can keep that one. Thank you. Well, congratulations for a very, very nice presentation I really like. I also learn a lot coming from the the path of the social cybernetics, a research group

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I, where reflectivity is one of our key concepts.

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2 comments, one comment on one question. Your survival reflectivity proposal is a concept developed by you. You would like to develop further on that.

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Sure. Yes, I did not coin survival reflexivity. I was conscious of time. So there was a referendum on how you are making to you research this concept.

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sure, so survival reflexivity, just as a bit of background was developed by Hung and Appleton, who, researched with younger care, experienced peoples. They were looking at the initial transition out of State care.

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and found that when they were thinking about the future they were more concerned with basic day to day survival rather than having sort of space for these internal conversations, to mediate between themselves and structure, to understand what was possible, what they wanted to do, what their personal projects were.

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And so that's what survival reflexivity is. It constrains that space because we become preoccupied with survival? And that's just exactly what I was finding as they were facing this cliff edge at the end of higher education, I found that occurring again, which is quite sad really, if you have then got a degree.

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And then you are reducing opportunities due to structure to actually be able to capitalize on your success of that degree. I found that quite upsetting, you know.

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Yes, Ok, thank you very much. We can give the discussion after the other presentations. Thank you. So thank you so much for the comments for everyone

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I would like to invite Chanda. Patrick will be presenting socio-economic and gender inequalities, face-to-face bullying, and the cyber-bullying victimizations among the adolescents, a multi-level cross-national study please, Florida, see ours channel. Thank you.

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thank you very much. And good morning, everyone. And you are welcome.

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This is a

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I said.

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Okay, great. So I will just share with you what I am doing for my faces. And it's just an extraction of what I've been doing for

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the past 3 years. So

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yeah, so this is, this is an area that is of interest for me, because

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I've wicked as a child protection officer. But in my country, and the experiences that I have when it comes to the issues of violence against children as well as aspects of bullying, and I think bullying is also a so equivalent in in the wake prices. I think people may not actually know why why, what bowling is in the work process. So it's not just within

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or among us to a dollar sense, but also among us. I doubt it happens. And it's so privilege in most of the presses, and, like I mentioned, even in the workplaces. But we may not not. We may not know that this is actually pulling. We may think it's a job, or we may think it's just someone is playing around. That is a bullying.

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So

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the motivation like I mentioned comes from my experience as a child protection officer in this field

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and with the interactions that I have had with the children who have experienced this aspect of

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victimization. I've also interacted with different organizations. And

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I've learnt a lot.

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so my outline for this presentation is just that as as follows. and any

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like I mentioned bullying. I'll not give it the definition. But basically, according to

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there are different definitions that scholars have given.

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And basically, mostly they are focusing on the aspects of physical, psychological, peer rejection and the other dimensions that would focus on, you know, others would mention emotional aspect, and they they

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make detrimental impact that bullying has on the well being and health of children. Yeah, so it's at the global level. When you look at the statistics, it's a one of the social problems as well as the human rights issue that has impacted negatively on the well being of of children. So that's one of the

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the motivation motivating factors that

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I had in this topic. So when I, from the Literature Review, from the Peer, reviewed articles

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from the Jonas and

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Websites. From those ahly known international organizations, such as Unicef

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World Bank.

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a Unesco. So I got some of the

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statistics from from those and from the Literature Review. One of the key things that imaged was

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family affluence

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and bullying victimization.

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Most of the studies of that have been done that have based on socioeconomic status and its association with

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victimization as well as violence against children.

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and most of the studies have indicated that

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children from deprived socio-economic backgrounds are more likely to be victimized

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by body

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and

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violent

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of violence or aggressive behaviors.

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A priority set research also indicates that.

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 yeah, like I mentioned, there are more likely to be

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victimize, however, literally to indicate that there is a death of cross national research that has examined the relationship between family affairs and victimization by face to face, bowling and say, but face to face, others would use traditional bullying, which is offline and mostly done among us a dollar essence. Mostly they spend most of their time in schools, so it finds others would use physical.

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Others would use emotion or psychological, like

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using words that are demeaning. Others would use peer rejection where it it Ps. Would reject their ux could exclude it from the group. So that's as another aspect. So that's offline the inside. But bullying with advancements in technology. So this is also pre equivalent, I think, from the time I think mostly the studies have.

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I think, from day 9

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nineties somewhere there. But I think in the in the 2,000, they from the 82,000, I think we have studies that are focused on cyber bowling.

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and most of the studies are also focused on the not just first to face bullying and inside baboon, but

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with the relationship between socioeconomic status with

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homicide, others are focused on instead of bullying. But homicide and others have also focused on the other aspects of victimization.

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And then another theme that imaged From the literature review was income, inequality and bowling victimization. And most of the studies I I I've I've mentioned focused on in income, inequality and

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violent victimization among us. The adults, mostly violent victimization, homicide. I think most of the studies that have been done in Europe and the Us. Are focused on much on their association. The relationship between income inequality

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and violent victimization as well as property victimization, for instance, theft

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and climb, mostly crime related victimization.

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and in when it comes to income, inequality and side by bullying that a few studies that are focused on this, for instance, finding such as due and colleagues, and then Elgar and colleagues 2,019 suggest that societies with high levels of income inequality have

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greater odds, odds of victimization areas studies. Also how I've also shown that inequality in income contributes to highlights of bullying among us. adults. That's a by picket. And we will kings on.

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And further evidence from research indicates that lack of access to resources leads to increased levels of income inequality which in turn

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meditates against people's ability to move upward in social mobility. This leads to hopelessness, frustration, and increased risk for violent and aggressive barriers. Area research by Kate Kawach and Kennedy found that income inequality all day. Such

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sources of social support which resulted in flag of social networks and created social, socially disorganized societies, resulting, resulting in acts of violence and aggression to debt.

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however, to date, reviewed literature in the case that far less close national research has focused on the relationship between income inequality and victimization by face to face, bullying and cyber bullying. So most of the studies are.

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we are not close national research. Mostly there were dinners in specific countries.

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and that's why we have fewer studies that I have focused on

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of of income, inequality and victimization by face to face, bullying and cyber boarding, especially when it comes to cyber booting. There are fewer studies that have focused on the relationship between income inequality and victimization.

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Another theme that emerged from the from Literature review was gender inequality and bowling victimization. So mostly the studies. scholars have used gender lens to understand

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gender inequality and violent victimization. I I've mentioned. Most of the studies are focused on homicide, gender, inequality and needs association with the vibrant victimization with homicide. Others have also focused on property victimization.

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So the scholars have found that when women participate in routine activities

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like in the labour market, they are more likely to be at increased risk of victimizing. So they one of the theories that I used in my in my, in my, in my paper was a lifestyle routine activity. That's a combination of

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life routine activities and exposure field. So it's that no focus is on opportunity. See all this. So this is because their lifestyle routine activities create opportunities for them to interact with potential offenders in public domains.

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reviewed literature in case that there is a the scarcity of close national studies that have examined the relationship between gender inequality and victimization by face to face, and Bullying and cyber bullying.

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Some of the key questions that the objectives that

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led to the development of the key questions were as follows.

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let us to examine how family of affluence relates to face to face bullying and cyber bullying victimization.

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as well as how income inequality relates to face to face boarding and cybering victimization across the countries, and how gender inequality influences face to face, bullying

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and cyber bullying victimization at close national level. So I'm I'll also use the the other theoretical perspective that I used was the social ecological model because my studies mouth level. So it's informed. My i' to my research methodology because it's it has different layers and my studies mouth level. So the social ecological.

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because it has different systems or different layers that influenced my methodology, which is mouth-level analysis.

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And then I also use the social support theory because of the more dilation. I have not included those, because it's you which is, I was all going to finish within the few minutes that I have, but I also used in my paper the more dilate as with the social support, because that in trying to modulate the relationships.

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yeah. So I've also not included the conceptual framework. But we win my conceptual framework. I've indicated which which which ones are the main predictors at the individual level, and then which ones are the main predictors at the country level

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to the school level, because this students are nested within the schools, and then schools are nested within the countries. But at the school, if I didn't include them more delta, as because the data sets that are you, I'm using, you know, have the the the variables that are would be used at the the school at Level 2, which is school level. I've seen mostly such as of

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I've done group mean centering where they have created variables, using the individual level valuables to come up with fair

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level 2 variables. But again, there are arguments in research why we should not use such. Yeah.

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again, I like, I mentioned, those are the questions that were developed on the basis of the gaps identified in the Literature Review. And that's both the impedical and theoretical Literature Review.

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Like I said, I got the. I'm using the data from the 2018

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health behavior and school age children survey. So that's just a type of survey outside this.

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which way I combined with the country level data. So I got the gender in Inequality Index, the from the on Dp.

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and then the gene Index, mostly from the World Bank.

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and then the national wealth, the Gdp per capita from the different countries that participated in this and then sexual because of

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the gender inequality. And then that's the number of adolescence and the ages at 1113 and 15 from 27 European countries to exclude some of the countries because of the missing variables.

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And then my studies, Mount Level Cross National cause, I'm using different data from different countries combined. May, yeah, put together. So they and analytics, strategies, Free Level amount level modeling because students are nested within schools and schools are nested within countries. So to account for the variations.

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within schools

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between schools and then variations between countries and within countries. And

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yeah.

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and then this is a mixed effects, binary logistic regression modeling, since in dependent variables were dichotomized and recorded as dumb variables, and this is a common practice by scholars like those that have indicated there.

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In terms of I've just give this some. I've just given the summary of the some of the key findings from this paper. So one of the key things that image from the data was the relationship between family affairs and victimization by first to first bullying and cyber bullying.

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 The findings showed that low family family affluence was associated.

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Oh, okay, was associated with

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of of face to face victimization. Then the studies The findings also showed that

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low family offerings was also associated with cyber bullying victimization.

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Sorry I spent most of my and then the other theme that imaged was the negotiation between income inequality and the 2 aspects of victimization.

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So income inequality was positively and significantly associated with the 2 forms of bowling victimization, and one of the key explanation would be that income inequality

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has collected effect on social cohesion and support.

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Income. Inequality also leads to social divisions and status, differences and power differentiates which in turn weaken social fabrics resulting in in adequate social control and social problems, such as

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aggression and interpersonal violence.

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And then the other thing was the relationship between gender inequality and tradition, of bullying and cyber, bowing the results. They showed that

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gender inequality was posted, both positively and significantly associated with both

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face to face and side by boarding victimization, and some of the key. explanation of possible explanations is that cultural context and gender social structures that will enforce power, imbalances and restrictions on opportunities such as education and labour market and choices would contribute to that so structural factors. And then dominance motives that's which sustain and promote social highlights and competitions will also influence

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the associations.

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and then, in terms of the strength of of the study.

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they started, used large sample and random samples from countries with with different socio-economic, political and cultural contexts, income and gender inequalities were studied between countries rather than within countries.

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And then in the study provides some information on socio-economic context of bullying which can inform police interventions that can in time address bullying income and gender inequalities

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in terms of limitations. This is across this cross-section of study. So further research, such as long-term studies would be needed

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to, should be.

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it undertaken to establish cause of interpretations then, in terms of generalizability to all the social, cultural, social, cultural, and economic contexts solely said should be replicated in another social and cultural economic backgrounds.

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And then they study, relied on the self report measures of the 2 aspects of bullying victimization. So the further research, the future research, should call abolish the self reports with informants, such as parents and teachers.

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And then, in terms of the conclusion, the findings suggest that economic and socio-economic and gender inequalities are significant risk factors for the 2 aspects of victimization.

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and adolescents who live in countries with higher levels of socioeconomic and gender in qualities are more likely to experience higherlights of polling victimization than those in lower level with lower levels of social, economic, and gender inequalities. Gaining a broader understanding of these risk factors for bullying victimization can help in planning and devising and bullying prevention policies and interventions.

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Adults, sense from deprived socio-economic backgrounds as well as those in areas of high income and gender inequalities, should be the main focus of police interventions and and bullying

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campaigns. Thank you very much. That's the end of my presentation.

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I would like to thank you to Chanda for your nice presentation about violence and civil bullying

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connected to the gender family and income issues. And it's a wider comparative analysis, qualitative analysis. Is there anybody who would like to command or give a question. Thank you for your presentation so lovely. I gained a lot of knowledge about it. Thank you.

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Yes, please.

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Oh, I can give you the right mic.

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Thank you for this presentation, I think, provides really important context and a kind of grand overview of

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what it looks like these associations are relevant to face to face and cyber bullying. So I'm wondering if you can go back to your slide about the strength of this study because you mentioned earlier, when you start your presentation, that bully can be

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a very, very delicate concept in terms of what count is bullying, and especially when you add cyber bullying to that what is defined as Boeing. So you mentioned that this is across national study, and there are various different cultural contexts

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and in terms of. So I wanted to know a little bit more about how the survey attended to these cultural

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this cultural interpretations, or what is there any attendance to this nuanced understanding of what bullying is or what is not? And if that's the case, are there plans to

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further understand these local contexts through perhaps a qualitative component or something like that. Thank you. Wonderful. Thank you for the brilliant question. like you've mentioned

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when I was doing my presentation back in in Hong Kong

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I was asked about the definition of Poly, because there are scholars, for instance, this

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who I've defined. They are focused on like I mentioned, we see on an eco-power or power imbalances the bullies

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and then the victims, and then the body body victims. So mostly they have relied on an Eco power in terms of those who use physical and then psychological or emotional, and then peer ejection and and and and stuff like that.

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But I was told that there is a new definition by the World Health Organization, and they are not focusing on an eco-powering imbalances. So I've been trying to look at the new definition, because, like, you know, social sciences.

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we are always.

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you know, things. Concepts are always changing, evolving and stuff like that on the basis of

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you know them, then they are new, their dynamics. It changes because of the socioeconomic as well as political and cultural context. So even the console needs to look at the new definition that was coined by the World Health organization. So I I did the presentation, I think.

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last week.

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So I've been trying to look at the new definition, and then, like you mentioned way that it reflects on the dynamics in terms of the social, cultural, Economy, socioeconomic and cultural as well as the political context? Yeah. And then when it comes to the

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social, economic.

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cultural, and political factors that may play a kilo when it comes to

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that, you know the connection or the associations between gender in a gender and income inequalities, and the 2 aspects of boarding, especially when it comes to side by boarding, because it's it may not be easy if even when we are talking about, you know, social support or interventions cause it's done online and what you using different platforms.

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So when it comes to the fact that, like social, economic, cultural, and political factors, I think that's for faith, that understanding. I think that's what I yeah, I would want to focus on. Because this one, I was just using a secondary data. And I was constrained when it comes to the imaging issues that, like you mentioned, qualitative mixed methods

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would be very appropriate and would be enhanced our understanding of the socioeconomic, cultural and political factors that may play a kilo when it comes to this aspect which affects.

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and not only like I mentioned adolescents or children, but also

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adults in the workplace. You may not but just take note. You may find just a little more about workplace bullying, it happens, and it affects everyone.

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Thank you very much.

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 yes, I'm I'm from Brazil. So first, congratulations for your presentation. Thank you. And I want to make a question.

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At the first time I I saw that you put today specifically for the next jobs to research encounters of South Europe. Because, like you, you have this data from 27 countries. But we know that.

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the Europe countries have one history, one's perspective in comma. But I would like to know that if you, during this research, you're thinking about other perspectives that well, like

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you say about gender and socio-economic. But if you in some moment you're thinking about race regression or other intersections that a could be applied for when we're thinking about bullying inside the pooling as well. Okay, yeah. it's interesting, because the you know, they are

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good

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characteristics, for instance, personal characteristics. One of all. demographic characteristics. One of them is about ethnicity or less.

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and then they are also, you know, gender, which is also developed, and it's a smart dimension. So they it's a like, especially when you when when when we talk about Europe America.

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yeah, the Us. Canada. And and yeah, so we. They are those countries which are part of

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you know they they they, the h, h, b, s, C, yeah. So mostly, those aspects are also important when they demographic factors, because race you know, ethnicity gender, which is also, you know, discussed in different different angles from different perspective. It would also be very important to see

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from, you know, using the gender lens. They are, you know, at the moment. We also have the, you know, the and stuff like that. That would also be important for researchers to explore how? you know they are those. Those groups are also affected when it comes to buying.

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because, you know, they are different groups. That may be, you know, affected because of who they are. So it's very important, I think, from a human rights perspective. That would be very important to, you know, disaggregate the data. I need to have the information that so that, like as we are talking about these aspects. You know, social, economic, and gender inequalities. How those groups would also be impacted. Yeah.

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yeah, sure you you're welcome

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yesterday.

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Thank you so much. Zoe Baker University of York. And thank you. I'm just bringing up my notes. So when I've been looking down, I've not been on social media, I've been taking notes on your presentation. Thank you so much for that. I was interested on your literature review slides. You mentioned that those participating in, say, the labour market were more likely to encounter those who may perpetuate violence to them. The homicide points for gender-based violence, and

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from my, I suppose, quite ignorant perspective in your area as a layperson, because I've not researched this before, I would have thought that those that were maybe participating may be less likely because they would be less isolated, you know, if they were in the home, they may be more vulnerable to gender-based violence because they are less connected. I was wondering, is there any literature that stays the opposite, then that that corresponds with that point?

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Wonderful! Wonderful! Actually, I I came across such literature like you've mentioned because domestic violence, gender-based violence, domestic mostly in the studies that have been done in the Us.

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I think, and some of the European countries. women, for instance, during Covid. I may be given just giving an example or for those who may not necessarily be victims when they go out. But the feminist theorists. Actually, they have used the done, the studies

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when it comes. Women still participating, you know, being victims at home because of maybe their spouse.

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Or maybe it could be the siblings and stuff like that. So there are studies that are focused on homicide which took place at

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just at the home. Maybe the the spouse.

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You know it has been the the victim, or has been victimizing the other one. So the lifestyles they have used the feminist theories

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as well as the lifestyles routine activity. Because you maybe you have lost the job. You are not active in the labor market, but you still be become a victim because of your spouse, or maybe because of your sibling. So they have actually also used the those theories, lifestyles, routine activities because

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you are not participating in the labour market, but you may be participating in the other, you know aspects, or it could be, maybe with from the sexually productive health dimension. Maybe there could be some disagreements and stuff, or it could be in terms of

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cause the lifestyles you are exposed, not because the pipette is out there in the in the community, but it's within the house, within the the whole, your home. So they have used the feminist theories as well as the the lifestyles routine activities. So it could be within that place. So a feminist theories have actually focused on that. And they have a lot of studies that have been done. And when it comes to gender based violence within that context.

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Yeah, thank you so much, Patrick. You're welcome. Shall we move on? Thank you very much for your lovely talk.

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and we would like to invite our remote presenter, sure

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piecemeal will be our friend. We will be presenting more playgrounds, police officers, or the other kids to the play with children's reflections on how to improve

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their leisure in a suburb of Caribbean Khaliba

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Keysma.

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Please let them You can share your screen with us.

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ferpzml: Okay? And floor is yours.

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ferpzml: Okay.

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it's giving you

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flow of the cells. Yes, scream

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and

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yes, thank you.

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ferpzml: please. Forward.

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ferpzml: you need to speak a little bit louder. Thank you. Now you can hear me. Yes, we can hear you. Okay. Thank you. So good morning. Everyone.

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ferpzml: Thank you for accepting my presentation, and as I'm writing this part of my cheeses, it will be a pleasure to discuss this theme with you in this work group.

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ferpzml: So the purpose of this communication is to explore the relationship between the type of space and the tangible as well as symbolic relationship

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ferpzml: fostered within them. By doing so we seek to compare the dispositions, is still in children, their life aspirations, and their desires for their neighborhood, neighborhoods and city.

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ferpzml: It is important to recognize that as societies and and social movements may be V. To roles in shaping children's experiences within this basis. So when you introduce the topic and the direct theoretical discussion. Then we, I will move on to the methodology and the analysis, and to finally point out some conclusions. So in 1,943,

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ferpzml: Alfred, I guess.

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ferpzml: Okay, Alfred, I guess proposed to organizations organization plans for Brazilian cities.

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ferpzml: but there were all implemented inquiry. Chiba, during the 1,970 s. Bossite and other North American agencies. Financed urbanization projects in underdeveloped conference, including which focused on environmental concerns and gained international recognition as an ecological city.

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ferpzml: Could Itiba aim to to eliminate it Islam, by relocating the sorry

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ferpzml: the low income the poor people to the city's outskirts, especially in the south of the city.

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ferpzml: The new industrial city, supported by you sites head as on a head and a as an objective integrated them into the labor market. However, limited factory housing led to the emergence of Islam, like Kashimba, near to the landfill where families worked in waste recycling.

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ferpzml: So Kashimba, located south of the city, has the highest green area per inhabitants, but faced environmental issues due to the land fields operation without lessons

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ferpzml: license

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ferpzml: measures we're taking to address decisions, including the creation of the debujo, wild wildlife refugee and the clematis risk management project that aims to transform the linked field into a solar a pyramid. as you can see in this.

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ferpzml: what it just could be.

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ferpzml: He's a housing complex for families displaced from the thermal settlements near to the bargain by by Re River, the nearby ugly Sh. This occupation is home to approximately 1.5 500 families, and has connections with social movements.

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ferpzml: the residents actively participate in assembly and contribute to the development of the community. the first sovereign region of which, in compasses a significant population reside in in, out to us, side areas, confronts substantial socioeconomic challenge, including low income height in employment and social issues.

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ferpzml: Recognizing the perspectives of children within these neighborhoods is of at most importance, considering their significant representation among the local population. As you can see in this map, the most part of the person. Touch of the children who lives in the south of this city is more important as the city who needs in the other parts of the

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ferpzml: children's perceptions of their living spaces are influenced by various agents and institutions, especially The this teams is are especially analyzed by Java, Tier and Berke Bernadette, and and at low, positive, and negative aspects shape their views.

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ferpzml: We've adults playing a significant role in their daily activities. Schools is exposed children to sometimes expose children to violence, and it's strict to rules. But in jails provide alternative approach focusing on 9, 30 days education and practical activities

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ferpzml: to analyze the child neighborhood relationship. A typology with 4 profiles representing different perceptions and ways of living in the illegal city was created.

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ferpzml: These profiles help understand the dispositions shape shaped by your bone practices. So the methodology in this is study

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ferpzml:  so it is a study conducted in 3 associations or in deals in the illegal city. We interviewed 18 participants, 9 boys and night groups between the ages of 9 and 12

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ferpzml: mit. Ctl. And our goal was to explore their understanding and perspectives of the neighborhoods the participants were shown various various photos of the neighborhoods, such as residences, schools, commercial streets, social projects, and Joe's 250

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ferpzml: libraries, sparks and squares. Individual interviews lasted between 1225 to 50 min.

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ferpzml: We created 2 databases. The first one includes variables to distinguish the children by their location, age, gender, family, composition, residential history, and social background, 150.

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ferpzml: You you we used to variable, such as parents, occupations, place of residents, and governmental assistance to code their social backrupts. This. So the second one collected variables related to the participants use and understanding of the neighborhood, covering various activities and types of social interactions.

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ferpzml: So the first group is the community area.

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ferpzml: Children in the humanitarian group find support and security. We see within their neighborhoods creating a strong sense of community. Despite limited region of movement, they view residents as protective, few figures straightening their bounds of in density, identity, and belonging

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ferpzml: Christian, and

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ferpzml: emphasize the units and mutual of support among residents, Christian and and residents. They recognize each other and solve problems collectively, such as organizing track treats to a persona park during the summer to straight neighborhood size.

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ferpzml: According to Christian, everyone is united and provides existence when needed. Emily appreciates differently hemosphere and the sense of belonging.

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ferpzml: When someone is said they try to help them feel better. Livia Alberta, who are children of community leaders, feel protected.

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ferpzml: Their homes serve as shared spaces for neighborhood associations. Livia's house is uses is used for project project, resistate re registrations. One is house serves as a meeting place, and now that's house is the central community project in Casimba, even receiving a local awards.

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ferpzml: These children value value mutual support and care, seeing the neighborhood as something to be nurtured rather than feared. So. The second group there is a there resilience. I changed his name.

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ferpzml: resilient children's face. Displacement and stress from crime, accidents and reviews, dysfunctional streets confined children to their homes or local associations for safety, limited resources and absent parents contribute to to their struggles, including Le Andrew, which is F. A sense of loss, despise. Despite his employed parents.

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ferpzml: however, laundr's house provides sole and camaraderie. I mean the negative neighborhoods

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ferpzml: getting to school in the illegal city is a major challenge for children who primarily walk.

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ferpzml: They deal with inadequate infrastructure and long distance, especially in better weather. Now, nonetheless, school offers refuse fostering friendships, games and sensory sensory experiences that are otherwise restricted. Sarah and Yen have their.

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ferpzml: I have some some limitations, sat up with Ross after a traumatic incident, while Ian since his neighborhood as a nightmare that nightmare without recreational spaces.

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ferpzml: The children long for change, and once you escape their their environment, while others consider becoming police officers feeling constrained by their neighborhoods, they perceive the public as edge of their service, and see running away, or punishment as the solution to break, to break.

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ferpzml: So the third group is the

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ferpzml: the third group of children has an ambivalent relationship with their neighborhood. They feel both secure and protect, but also identify problematic individuals and areas to avoid.

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ferpzml: Marina, like Vito, has mixed feelings about local residents, recognize both friendly and rude individuals. The neighborhood itself has a dial nature, offering pleasant place spaces but require requiring caution.

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Marina

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ferpzml: find solace in the project, and their house

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and her house, where she can engage in activities and play.

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ferpzml: These children have working parents making self-reliance necessary. They navigate the neighborhood independently, especially to go into the local markets. Why this test? This tasks aren't enjoyable. They are part of life demands.

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ferpzml: The children are critical of the neighborhoods. It's structural conditions and desire urban change, such as more recreational areas and approved schools. Despite this, they want to continue, leaving there.

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ferpzml: valuing their knowledge and connections with residents. They understand the the need for transfer transformations to facilitate, they tasks and less group. The adventurers, a juventus. Children excel in outdoor activities, exploring further and expanding ankle

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ferpzml: unsupervised time. They join other older France for diverse at the venturous like kite, flying

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ferpzml: soccer, skateboarding, forest exploration and swimming or fishing inquiries known for their dangers.

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ferpzml: Despite this, the neighborhood presents physical and moral limitations. How would avoid a distance square, due to safety concerns, and instead, explorers nearby woods with his cousin

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ferpzml: discovering plans and encountering wildlife.

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ferpzml: These boys share similarities in gender and recent relocation from the leg of city

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ferpzml: to this place, to to the legal city. Heavy seeds of different age grants them independence and the ability to assist with household corpse. Christians family settled in the neighborhood for stability, and quickly integrated into a social project, engaging in activities like multi M, maintaining at 3 house, have rattling and immersed themselves in nature.

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ferpzml: The associations embody the essence of an ideal neighborhood, providing providing invaluable opportunities to expand social networks, ging knowledge in those in recreational activities and engaging sports. These projects transcend physical boundaries, reshaping the children's connections not only with their families, but also with the world around them.

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ferpzml: Since their arrival. These children have a waiting witness to numerous numerous improvements in their lives, and have developed a strong desire to continue residing in their neighborhoods. So the final considerations, marks study, emphasize the importance of networks in people's life.

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ferpzml: lives diverse and ge geographically dispersed. Networks have a positive impact on the quality of life and professional opportunities for the middle and upper classes. In contrast, the working classes have less verse and more localized networks, making social capital crucial

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due to the limited economic and cultural resources.

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ferpzml: Access to net towards based on socioeconomic backgrounds affects opportunities and social mobility. Recognizing the significance of networks, helps us address inequalities arising from the varying access to social media.

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ferpzml: communitarian, chill, communitarian children and their parents have also realized the value of people with resources.

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ferpzml: In interestingly, these children display more ambition compared to the others which may provide them with social essential opportunities. Some indications are right, so already suggest this. Among 6 children, 2, one should be teachers, 2 girls, or to be doctors. One wants to division the veterinarian, and one is under sized

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ferpzml: among the adventurer of in adventurers. Once to aspire to become soccer players, and one wants to be a teacher.

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ferpzml: The do detective children don't know what they want to do in the future, as their their futures depends on their on on others and their families. Among the resigned. Once this resilient ones, one wants to be a mark. Put salesman. She wants to be policemen. One wants to be a veterinarian, and one was to leave outside Brazil.

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ferpzml: 2 children couldn't answer ambitious and determined children, uncertainty, uncertain futures, and more authoritarian personality. It starts to emerge, and these dispositions can be understood.

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ferpzml: based on their relationships with their neighborhoods, but not just that it is important to note that certain public policies, and to improve the living conditions of residents. In this study neighborhoods, however, there seems to be a lack of communication and engagement with the residents as an as most children have limited awareness of the these projects, or sceptical about their

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ferpzml: the children's suggestions, such as you for infrastructure, enhancements and improved services within the neighborhood would likely lead to greater satisfaction compared to the seeds. Government's vision of transforming the errors into Mobile.

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ferpzml: Thank you.

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Thank you, Fernando. It's very lovely talk of yours. It's a different aspects. We've been engaged with. The knowledge.

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Is that anybody would like to ask questions to her.

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You?

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No.

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yes.

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yes.

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please. Had this. Yeah. Well, thank you for your presentation. Very interesting in terms of the follow up of the trajectories of the

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of the children, and I don't know if you mentioned it, but I think

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it. It relates to the first presentation. I'm trying to to build up a point in terms of the reflectivity of the children. I don't know if you

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who like.

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could expand a little bit on that.

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on your findings, on how that came up during the interactions and in the interviews with them. Thank you.

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ferpzml: Yes, thank you for this question. Very interesting. I I just I can think about 2 points, and I maybe I could talk more about that. But I I will just explore to to points the first of them that when I was preparing to this presentation, I was, is, yeah. I have some doubts about using the word poor or illegal. It's something that I

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ferpzml: you should the I? I try to developed more in my cheese, but they they are not. They didn't. think sometimes that they are living in an illegal place, for example, and and and this is something that they can talking about that. And it's it's an interesting point. But the the more

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I think it a point that it's important to me. It's an example of a of a children

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ferpzml: Le Andrew. And every time I started an interview. I I I I always try to be nice. And I I said, sometimes I used to say that if they don't feel safe for the he, or if they

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ferpzml: we're not comfortable. For answer something they could. Just so in stop the interview. And this guy who I? At a moment, he just asking me to stop. And it was interesting, because he starts with some photos. And

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ferpzml: when he was telling me his history and the history of his family. He, I think he understood that a moment that they have had a better condition, a better life before coming to that place and their their parents. They

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ferpzml: I lose their jobs, and they came to the legal city, to the illegal city, who who, he feels. It's not a safe place to leave. He he's one of these children who wants to go leave

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ferpzml: abroad and and move to another country instead, live in Brazil. So

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ferpzml: I I think we have more possibilities to think about the reflexivity. But I just make this example, and it's it's

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ferpzml: it's a children that time.

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Shall we do you?

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They are not able to see you. You can come here if you wish. Ok. Up to you.

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it will be nice to face to face.

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How is it work? Is

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the kids help you to follow their kids that could make part as well like to know more about this process.

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ferpzml: Thank you.

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ferpzml: Thank you so much. Hi, keel and so from my teachers, I interviewed 50 children, and to this communication this presentation I just selected. Hmm, 18 of them and the first group we asked it at the major. And we, we have this official authorization. And then we came to schools.

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ferpzml: and we asked it, the directors and parents and children.

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ferpzml: and for this communication I just present some children that I interviewed. some of them at school, and some of them I went to this Ngos. So these associations with social projects, and I yes, Kate, the the organizers and the presidents of this association, and then the parents, and then the children.

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ferpzml: So I thought it would be harder to do that. But when I started this research. I was not thinking about studying slams or these outs of my see that I was thinking about studying middle class, and I asked it in some schools if they

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ferpzml: would.

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ferpzml: make me. And If they are, they allowed me to do the research in this schools, especially private schools. And I didn't have any authorization. So so

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ferpzml: I think maybe I can

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ferpzml: thank you. Thank you very much. Is there anybody else who would like to comment or ask a question.

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If not, I think we can sum it up. I can say my words, and then you can share your words.

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I would like to thank you to Zor. She has given us a different insight. When I was in England in 1,900 ninetys at that time, I can see that the work is going on more on social work and social care, and a lot of case studies being carried on at that time. Now, the

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the paper you presented to us. It shows us the connection to the reflexivity, and, as you say, survival reflexivity. It's a different aspect and a life course.

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and as a project, you were evaluating it over it, and the stories of their experiences of your interviews, and you give us a case. Study information from England. This is a different way of methodological approach in our session.

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and thank you very much for Chanda as well. He bring us a different side of the evaluation, which is bigger data, and with the comparative level of 27 European countries. And

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this is different way of evaluating the already existing data and the rest of the things, and quite a big number of people being involved inside. It's it's a multi-level cross national study. When I was in Taiwan we attended a Methodological Conference, and it was main issue. It was that

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the Siber area and identity of the people there. So it is very difficult to identify who is bullying whom

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this was the main discussion, and I can see that you took these discussions another level in between cross section of childhood sociology and social cybernetics aspects. It's nice to hear your words. And Fernando give us her insights about

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critiques and the unequal Brazil. It's a kind of example, an illegal occupation of a land in Kushimba if I am not pronouncing properly. I'm sorry for that, but it gave me it. Remind me, my own amazed students, experiences and dissertation about elbow

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in Iraq and the children's experiences, and how they are being in difficulty to find to entertain themselves, or

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In layer leisure times. It is difficult to find spaces, and Kushimba and occupation. They need more playgrounds. We were working on different sides of Airbil. But, Kushimba, it's another important example. I think I was enjoying when I was listening you and

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we were mentioning some of the negative aspects of the some of certain neighbourhoods. This is very important for the children. And there, when we look at from the side of the social cybernetics side, I think Patricia will give more insights on this. I think we will gain a lot of knowledge.

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Both Rcs are C 53 and Rc. 51. I'm both members of these Rcs. And it gives me pleasure to explore new areas in these research groups. Thank you for being here. And I would like to give words to at Leastia. Thank you very much.

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well, thank you for everyone, to everyone. It has been a around our or she since long time ago. And she this is the first session we do together with this. 2 topics, and I think it's it! It has been an excellent experience to bring up a more thematic.

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a research group with which is a kind of theory and methodology based on the systemic perspective. But that can be widely applied.

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Too many topics. And I I I think, I, the representation that we have show, I bold examples of how can we? A address of of course, the concept of reflectivity that was addressing the and the first presentation E. We have been a We. We already said it. It has been key for for

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a social cybernetics approach.

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But you might say, what is such a cybernetics or a perspective is very much related to

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to analyze the different social phenomena as systems, but by considering a not as static systems, but dynamic systems. So it can be the, the

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the care system and how it works, but also how the the agents, the persons who are interacting there reflect about the system itself. So that's key in our perspective

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for a systems, social systems, transformation we cannot transform, if we do not reflect on it with a second order perspective, which is another, a key concept that we use. How can we address a second level approach to these? to these interactions that we have in the specific setting. Of course Patrick gave a a different

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level of abstraction, and that is also something that, or a methodology or a theoretical framework holds these working in different levels. So a childhood family, all these areas of integration is a long time related to this approach. But we would like to share with you, some of

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hey, like the new readings that we that we have from from our own members. So you might want to explore, and one of the the latest production is from Bernard Scott, which is the top. The title is

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Cybernetics for Social Science.

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This I think it. Yes, here's my going, Ok. Supernatural, and thank you, I think, to 2,022, and it was edited

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in Braille real Ceres

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obsolete hybernetics, which also we would like to let you know that this is open, and is looking forward for a propositions of monographs where you can contribute with your own topic, always

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trying to make an effort to connect with the cybernetic or the systemic perspective. It doesn't have to be a book of theory, and that but with the examples on your own field.

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Jamie Marquette is the editor of this serie. He is here with us. It's part of our.

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and if you have more any question about how you could work in a collective proposal, or in an individual proposal from your thesis or so on it, then is it visible?

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I also say that to our firm in in Brazil.

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and also in 2,019, we we did a a special number of current sociology related to so associated with different papers from all members explaining these concepts that we have been addressing a reflexivity. the! The! The! The history of sociarnetics!

435
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Fabi Giglett, who is with us now was editor of that special issue, and also to say that that's an opportunity to take

436
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out some of your work that I'm I'm looking forward to see published.

437
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and nothing else to say, just to to let you know that we think this is an opportunity to make connections. We want to learn more on your topics topic that we consider is they they are

438
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extremely necessary to to address.

439
01:33:37.030 --> 01:33:59.119
and it's important to not to be only in our own groups, but to be a building bridges with other perspectives, other analytical cases, other geographies where these knowledge can be applied, because that I think, from our perspective from the C 51 theory is nice

440
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where application is relevant is necessary and is urgent. So thank you very much for your contributions. And for me, that's it.

441
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Thank you very much, Patricia. Thank you very much. I would like to thank you to the complex group and the volunteers to to helping us before we leave. I would like to have a picture, if you don't mind. with our friends from online.

442
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if we stand here, we can have all together a picture. Thank you very much

443
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for joining us. Hope to see you in our and other sessions as well

444
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pleased to meeting you.