WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.001 --> 00:00:15.000 Alright, let me start. Can they hear me? Okay, afternoon. Colleagues, those who are here in person and those who are online or virtual I'm Simon Mapadeim from South Africa. 2 00:00:15.000 --> 00:00:27.000 I've been asked to share this session and I'm a member of RC. I'll see a 0 7 the session has got 2 papers. 3 00:00:27.000 --> 00:00:32.000 And the 2 papers, 4 00:00:32.000 --> 00:00:40.000 Presented by. It's supposed to be presented by Van Smith. Event is here. 5 00:00:40.000 --> 00:01:02.000 And also ML, is a it seems like ML support is not here so we have one paper given that, I suggest that there we We give this a an an opportunity to share his work. 6 00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:20.000 With us that the the session as you might be aware. Is a title that this information in the techno mediatic public sphere this information in the techno mediating public sphere. 7 00:01:20.000 --> 00:01:28.000 While they always say the more they merry, I think sometimes we find that few actually generate more interest in discussion. 8 00:01:28.000 --> 00:01:45.000 So I welcome you. All to this session. And, we'll be giving, Ben and opportunity from the University of Wallongo here in Australia an opportunity to share with us his paper. 9 00:01:45.000 --> 00:02:01.000 Which is the title of individualized. And collect by cyber deviance. But here the title I think has changed slightly to the tangling social cyber-cyber. 10 00:02:01.000 --> 00:02:08.000 We all, consider about cyber security but the event actually brings us to something else. Cyber devians. 11 00:02:08.000 --> 00:02:14.000 This is very interesting. Typical sociological Title. So I'm going to hand over to Ben. 12 00:02:14.000 --> 00:02:27.000 When you have enough time, please enjoy yourself. They have a privilege of time or no pressure. So over to when Thank you so much. 13 00:02:27.000 --> 00:02:50.000 Thank you for for having me and I'll just quickly just do an acknowledgement of of the country that we're on and the the custodians of the and knowledge holders past present and emerging for both this land and for where I'm from which is the durable country of the Wadi Wadi. 14 00:02:50.000 --> 00:03:05.000 But yeah, I, yeah, uploaded the same slides which was intentional apart from the title was supposed to be different so So for a different presentation. 15 00:03:05.000 --> 00:03:14.000 I hadn't written this. The chapter that this is based on, it's all based on my PhD project about cyber deviants. 16 00:03:14.000 --> 00:03:20.000 But largely what will talk about will be fairly similar. 17 00:03:20.000 --> 00:03:28.000 Yeah, so essentially my Hey PhD project is about. What's called cyber deviants. 18 00:03:28.000 --> 00:03:37.000 Which generally is, you know, is a term that we haven't used but I'm calling for it as an umbrella term. 19 00:03:37.000 --> 00:03:52.000 For a lot of things that most people are probably more familiar with so it's you know your inappropriate online conduct So your conflict that's more than just a polite disagreement on online where those shouting matches. 20 00:03:52.000 --> 00:04:00.000 That's cyber bullying, it's online harassment, it's these things called trawling spamming. 21 00:04:00.000 --> 00:04:15.000 But it also I'm including it into the spread of misinformation. So how people on social media websites will share fake news or propaganda or conspiracy theory. 22 00:04:15.000 --> 00:04:35.000 So basically a lot of this has come like my theory around cyber deviance and calling it calling for an umbrella term is is out of the literature reviewed for my thesis. 23 00:04:35.000 --> 00:04:38.000 And Yeah, out of that I've kind of theorized you can break it into 3 styles. 24 00:04:38.000 --> 00:04:53.000 One of it is more relevant to here so I'll probably spend bit more time on that. But the first style is you're you're trolling, your general entertainment and jovial. 25 00:04:53.000 --> 00:05:01.000 It's something that's done for humor for the display of the spectacle. The It is about what you can get away with. 26 00:05:01.000 --> 00:05:13.000 So it relates to cats theory of sneaky thrills. 27 00:05:13.000 --> 00:05:18.000 The next style is the is cyberbullying and online harassment. So this is different from that. 28 00:05:18.000 --> 00:05:21.000 It doesn't involve the humor as much. It is more about a targeted attack. It's a power thing and about aggression. 29 00:05:21.000 --> 00:05:42.000 It's usually more personal. And quite often this is what happens not necessarily in the open space of the social media it is your private messaging where where a lot of that will happen. 30 00:05:42.000 --> 00:05:57.000 And then third we've got the third style is what I call entities establishmentarianism. And this is where that propaganda and conspiracy ideation and fake news and misinformation kind of lie. 31 00:05:57.000 --> 00:06:04.000 So this is where there are such things as what would have been called troll armies. 32 00:06:04.000 --> 00:06:13.000 So there's where there are like state based actors like the Kremlin or there's I think China has something called the Tencent Army. 33 00:06:13.000 --> 00:06:23.000 Where they just paid to produce tweet after tweet at 10 cents a tweet. They've just essentially propaganda. 34 00:06:23.000 --> 00:06:32.000 So these kind of this style kind of tries to hide as one of the other 2 styles in order to stop a discussion that's already happening. 35 00:06:32.000 --> 00:06:45.000 So for instance in the project that I'm doing we're looking at comment sections of news and satire articles. 36 00:06:45.000 --> 00:07:09.000 It's, This will appear as a discussion will start to happen. Relating to the article that the comment section is on and then someone will come in with an outrageous conspiracy-based theory and it will derail the conversation away from having an actual discussion. 37 00:07:09.000 --> 00:07:17.000 It can also look like the other way around. There's, people will be talking about. 38 00:07:17.000 --> 00:07:35.000 How climate change isn't isn't real or something and someone will then go on and spam link off the link to different websites all about Climate change so it has that other thing which then creates an idea that maybe there is something else going on or maybe that is a conspiracy. 39 00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:43.000 If that's the tactic that's being being taken. 40 00:07:43.000 --> 00:07:49.000 Yeah, so 41 00:07:49.000 --> 00:07:59.000 As I said, when I Submitted the abstract for this one. I thought that the chapter that I was writing was gonna go down a slightly different path than it did. 42 00:07:59.000 --> 00:08:18.000 So it's not so much about the misinformation as I thought it was looking like. It was more about how the different pages have different a different more common styles of cyber deviants that go on on them. 43 00:08:18.000 --> 00:08:29.000 For instance, like I look at both satire and Sirius, the satire news articles being from the Bituda advocate and the Chaser Australia. 44 00:08:29.000 --> 00:08:49.000 And then serious news news. Thatlets were ABC News Australia and Sky News Australia. I took a bunch of articles about the black summer bushfires of 2,019, 2,020 and just went from January and then looked at the comment sections under those. 45 00:08:49.000 --> 00:09:03.000 On Facebook. And what I've started to see is that On the there is more humor use in the comment sections of the satire articles. 46 00:09:03.000 --> 00:09:23.000 On me which doesn't seem to be you know out of place they are satire there's they're using humor so there is more of that style one, that that that drove you trolling going on where people will tag their friends and say no this is about you this is about your uncle, your uncle's a climate 47 00:09:23.000 --> 00:09:40.000 denier and these kinds of things. The interesting thing that I have started to see is there is a lot more on the ABC and the Sky News Australia of that more outright verbal attacks. 48 00:09:40.000 --> 00:09:59.000 Against one another. But interestingly I've started to see particularly on on Sky News Australia that people who were in who were against the idea of client of human-based climate change don't call themselves climate change deniers, they call them themselves climate realists. 49 00:09:59.000 --> 00:10:17.000 There's an interesting little thing where there's this, group of people are essentially instead of like trying to distance themselves from that that the crazy people who are clamor denied deniers and saying no no no we're rational 50 00:10:17.000 --> 00:10:27.000 We just don't think it's real. So it's that this is an interesting phenomena to start to see. 51 00:10:27.000 --> 00:10:36.000 Yeah. That's most of what I had to like come and present on. It's odd being. 52 00:10:36.000 --> 00:10:49.000 In a room of 2 people. So I work better dealing with questions. So you know if I've summarized generally what my project and what my thesis is about. 53 00:10:49.000 --> 00:10:59.000 So you know if I've summarized generally what my project and what my thesis is about so Yeah, II think it would be easier to deal with this as questions. 54 00:10:59.000 --> 00:11:18.000 Very short implementation. So basically you just want to hear our views, our momentum. I used to. No, I I'm aiming to submit by the end of the year so I need I need the submit by the end of the year so I need not need the feedback on this idea of like I need the feedback on this idea of how is it a good way of looking at 55 00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:26.000 deviants on this idea of how is it a good way of looking at deviance online, is it a good way of looking at deviance of like how you know is it a good way of looking at deviance online of looking at deviance online of those of this happens in a social media space. 56 00:11:26.000 --> 00:11:37.000 This session even though it's not at Well, it's going to be This session is going to be in is going to be projected. 57 00:11:37.000 --> 00:11:47.000 It's been recorded, so. You would be able to receive the presentation where you see, a tension outside of 58 00:11:47.000 --> 00:11:56.000 Outside of this. Yeah. 59 00:11:56.000 --> 00:12:04.000 Yeah, so I think. Yeah, I don't know. It seems like, yeah, it's only me and Josh are here now. 60 00:12:04.000 --> 00:12:17.000 And we will. I'll post questions to you. Er because it is unfortunate but because this is very important in my view is a very important study. 61 00:12:17.000 --> 00:12:27.000 And it's a kind of study that in my view. Should actually be. To inspire more. 62 00:12:27.000 --> 00:12:36.000 Or more. And I will very much like to share this bill in South Africa would like to show you. 63 00:12:36.000 --> 00:12:51.000 Of our young, our young sociologist. Yeah, masters and then PhD. So that the, especially the masters, they so that they can't inspire. 64 00:12:51.000 --> 00:13:04.000 And perhaps you could consider doing something like this. So the whole thing about that is in Yes, I said usually we talk about cyber security. 65 00:13:04.000 --> 00:13:18.000 No, this is more like a, what, sociologically, obviously I would say I want to know. 66 00:13:18.000 --> 00:13:34.000 And this is my expectation. What what what theoretical framework are you using? Okay, so I'm using more micro sociology stuff so a lot more like 67 00:13:34.000 --> 00:13:45.000 Goffman and then social interaction theory and things like that so it is more how people take a line and take a position. 68 00:13:45.000 --> 00:13:55.000 Present themselves in certain ways. Yeah, I really think that the because you foregrounded the concept of deviance. 69 00:13:55.000 --> 00:14:02.000 Yeah, so then that's that's using a lot more like to do with cats, junk cats and the seductiveness of crime. 70 00:14:02.000 --> 00:14:14.000 I think you need to I don't know, I mean, How far you are you said you want to your you have aimed to start? 71 00:14:14.000 --> 00:14:26.000 But I will say yeah that conceptual framework Yeah, I don't know how much we have we have covered because I was expecting more there. 72 00:14:26.000 --> 00:14:44.000 We will say that concept is well and changing social media. So that conceptual framework you need to We need to make sure that the it is in the because of how in terms of how we understand behaviors to be here. 73 00:14:44.000 --> 00:14:55.000 And of course I mean the activities and behavior conduct. But you listed here. Is deviant in nature. 74 00:14:55.000 --> 00:15:06.000 Yeah. And It is even in nation because it is the opposite to what we will expect. But what does that also mean for normal? 75 00:15:06.000 --> 00:15:15.000 Social norms. And what values. So, so you need to move into that. 76 00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:22.000 But the nature of 77 00:15:22.000 --> 00:15:33.000 Oh, for instance, social media. Because that's the platform on which this is happening. The nature of social media. 78 00:15:33.000 --> 00:15:43.000 And. The nature of social media does it not in itself lend itself to this. Like his very nature. 79 00:15:43.000 --> 00:15:47.000 That there will be extra abuse. 80 00:15:47.000 --> 00:15:58.000 Of the platforms. And remember is it's also, it's virtual, nobody sees you. Right, so you can get away with things. 81 00:15:58.000 --> 00:16:15.000 And they remember also, you talk about Twitter for instance or Facebook. People don't don't put their correct or the correct identity they don't correctly or identify themselves. 82 00:16:15.000 --> 00:16:25.000 Let's see. They identify themselves but you find that they just use a pseudonate right so you will never be able to know who you are engaging with What kind of a character? 83 00:16:25.000 --> 00:16:32.000 So any body can open, can invade that space. Yeah, so I think the nature of that. 84 00:16:32.000 --> 00:16:38.000 Needs to be also you need to look at it in your life. This is where that that sneaky thrill and the seduction of crime kind of comes in. 85 00:16:38.000 --> 00:16:52.000 It's there that it's so easy I can get away with it that kind of part of it like it's the stealing a candy bar because it's there, not because I'm hungry. 86 00:16:52.000 --> 00:17:03.000 Just because I can get away with it. It's kind of that part of the seduction to do that is where that anonymity and the secretness kind of can lie. 87 00:17:03.000 --> 00:17:15.000 Where I kind of go, well, this is where. Links in more with that entertainment style because people are making their comments. 88 00:17:15.000 --> 00:17:32.000 To entertain themselves. In in some ways. It becomes hard to distinguish those between when is that someone making an outrageous comment to their own entertainment or when is it because they are being an aggressive? 89 00:17:32.000 --> 00:17:40.000 And this is where that you start to see the next comments afterwards and as that group kind of gets on board. 90 00:17:40.000 --> 00:17:54.000 And he goes, oh no, that is a joke. Let's continue with the joke. Or when is it like, oh no, they're they're being they've gone too far, they're not joking anymore, let's shut that down and they display their outset. 91 00:17:54.000 --> 00:18:02.000 Yeah, so that's where the interaction part comes in with that. Yeah, because I'm also thinking about. 92 00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:14.000 In sociological studies we look at also actors who look at agents, actors. In this particular case. It seems like our focus is more on perpetrators. 93 00:18:14.000 --> 00:18:23.000 Unless on there is those at the receiving end of it. Yes. Yeah, and are you are you touching or do you do you invent? 94 00:18:23.000 --> 00:18:34.000 Is that my correct impression or are you also into do you interview them? The those at the receiving end. 95 00:18:34.000 --> 00:18:43.000 To find out how they feel about that. I didn't get the ethics approval to do much with interviewing and then covert hit when I was collecting data so I wasn't able to do any interview component to it. 96 00:18:43.000 --> 00:18:50.000 So it would be great. That would be a great follow-up study to be able to then go in. 97 00:18:50.000 --> 00:19:03.000 The other problem is how do you get in contact with the people who are misbehaving? Yeah, you know, it's there. 98 00:19:03.000 --> 00:19:10.000 Who wants to actually put their hand up and say, no, I misbehave, let me tell you about who will actually, but there will be those who will say. 99 00:19:10.000 --> 00:19:15.000 I experienced this. Yeah. As as a victim. Yeah. 100 00:19:15.000 --> 00:19:33.000 And so that was part of like I wanted to go in saying looking at the other side because there is so much research that looks at it from the victims perspectives and what I was finding that's where a lot of the conflating terms. 101 00:19:33.000 --> 00:19:40.000 Kind of start coming up and research is using those. So I figured well if we go from the other way and go well. 102 00:19:40.000 --> 00:19:54.000 Here's what's being written about. Yeah. Let's create that distinguishing, separating out what these different styles are and how that that behavior Other researchers seem to be writing about it. 103 00:19:54.000 --> 00:20:04.000 And then maybe. If I could. Get in contact with some to talk about, you know, the perpetrators to see what their intent was. 104 00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:21.000 But yeah, unfortunately all I've got is just the The Lurka data essentially. So it's me just looking at the the comment section and and kind of going and looking at how the interactions played out. 105 00:20:21.000 --> 00:20:37.000 Now,'re doing one. Yeah for the analysis of it yes yeah collecting it I am it's it's like a sort of covert non-participatory. 106 00:20:37.000 --> 00:20:46.000 Digital ethnography Because, you know, like to get in, you need a Facebook page. 107 00:20:46.000 --> 00:20:50.000 So, you know, your Facebook account, so to get that. But on that comment section. The comments are available to anyone who has a Facebook account. 108 00:20:50.000 --> 00:21:04.000 So it is like taking it as the role of an everyday user. And an everyday user most of the time don't comment but they will have a look at the comment sections. 109 00:21:04.000 --> 00:21:11.000 Yeah. So I kind of took that perspective of like, well, what does this look like? Is happening here. 110 00:21:11.000 --> 00:21:22.000 Are there is that becoming a totally disruptive argument is that becoming oh that's a group of people just laughing about something these kinds of things Yeah. 111 00:21:22.000 --> 00:21:42.000 Or have you have presented this before? Before any way seminar or yeah I did just before this but the focus was more on the styles and the theory not the hey here are some results and the theory, not the hey here are some results and then here's not the hey here are some results and then here's what can be done with 112 00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:51.000 it. Yeah, yeah, because I think When you, well, but you post a glue to get another opportunity to present somewhere else. 113 00:21:51.000 --> 00:21:56.000 Yeah, my advice is that you 114 00:21:56.000 --> 00:22:04.000 Be a bit more detailed so people understand what methodologically you approached it. Even if they wanted to kill context of it. 115 00:22:04.000 --> 00:22:17.000 Yeah. Er it will benefit anyone who actually listens to your presentation to hear So far, what you presented so far. 116 00:22:17.000 --> 00:22:26.000 He told us what. You explain what, say what obedience is. And what it may, what it entails or what it covers. 117 00:22:26.000 --> 00:22:36.000 And then I was waiting for more. Yeah, much too fast. Pick up. Yeah. 118 00:22:36.000 --> 00:22:55.000 Before you could actually give us more, give us more. What your findings are especially findings yeah what do they say to the theoretical and the current body of knowledge here on the subject. 119 00:22:55.000 --> 00:23:15.000 The expectation is that it should actually add to, knowledge. Yeah. So how do, what you did is like you just went, you just went to my appetite and then just when I'm expecting that you went to my appetite and then just when I'm expecting that Yes. Yeah, yeah, I do. 120 00:23:15.000 --> 00:23:25.000 I do. Part of that is like, I haven't written. A lot of the content like the actual chapters before I'd made the slides and so I've just kind of gone, OK, well, what have I got in the slides? 121 00:23:25.000 --> 00:23:40.000 So yeah, that's just a timing of when these had to be sent in and things. That's just a timing of when these had to be sent in and things. 122 00:23:40.000 --> 00:23:47.000 Or, and then the other part is to be sent in and things. And then the other part is, unfortunately, because of the ethics, my ethics committee gave me the stipulation that I cannot. 123 00:23:47.000 --> 00:24:09.000 Display any quotes verbatim. Oh, but you can. Now they explicitly said no quotes verbatim in the written title. 124 00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:18.000 They, they, the, the, that you don't disclose the identity of that's of your participants. 125 00:24:18.000 --> 00:24:27.000 When I submitted that's what I said I said I would be providing anonymizing things and they said 126 00:24:27.000 --> 00:24:33.000 Sure, but don't. Quote them directly. But they did. My my my my ethics committee took an old school in the public space. 127 00:24:33.000 --> 00:24:46.000 I had that all in my ethics application. I had that all in my ethics application. I had that all in my ethics application. 128 00:24:46.000 --> 00:24:56.000 I had that all in my in my ethics application and yeah so this has been a big a big roadblock. 129 00:24:56.000 --> 00:25:06.000 Provokes. It's a very interesting kind of investigation. But it raises more questions. Then it gives answer. 130 00:25:06.000 --> 00:25:16.000 And now, I think from the ethics point of view. It also makes me wonder Why would the ethics committee? 131 00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:32.000 Actually say what they said to you. Because This ethical values and principles are meant to actually cover you and cover the participants and and the sources of information. 132 00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:43.000 But then I don't understand why you will be prohibiting their stipulations basically. Yeah. Their stipulation was, although the people have made comments on a publicly viewable spot. 133 00:25:43.000 --> 00:25:56.000 Yeah. They haven't done it. To me as a researcher. Like they haven't given permission for those to be part of research. 134 00:25:56.000 --> 00:26:02.000 So therefore I can't use them. About him. 135 00:26:02.000 --> 00:26:21.000 So I can't use them as like as exactly there. So I need to kind of like what I have been doing as I've been writing is kind of go, oh well these all talk very similarly and so I'll make up my thing that kind of looks very like very much like that but isn't exactly the same words 136 00:26:21.000 --> 00:26:37.000 that's being used. That's the main way that I've tried to get around it. 137 00:26:37.000 --> 00:26:42.000 You are able to make also further some policy recommendations of what should be done to make it as part of the regulation. 138 00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:52.000 Yeah. And that is very much the role of providing those services. Yeah. 139 00:26:52.000 --> 00:27:02.000 So it is important and also I think there's a lot that can be still investigated and researched on the subject. 140 00:27:02.000 --> 00:27:10.000 Yeah, what impact does this have psychologically? On the well-being of the recipients of this kind of poly. 141 00:27:10.000 --> 00:27:24.000 Yeah. Fake news And of course there's a you talked about also the entertainment part of it Yeah, but the most is one is just the negative one. 142 00:27:24.000 --> 00:27:34.000 Yeah, yeah, and that is where there's a big part that I'm making that distinction clear between that cyberbullying that I'm making that distinction clear between that cyberbullying and trolling is particularly in mainstream. 143 00:27:34.000 --> 00:27:37.000 Between that cyberbullying and trawling is particularly in mainstream as this information is particularly in mainstream. 144 00:27:37.000 --> 00:27:47.000 As this information gets mainstream, they just call it all trawling. Which kind of minimizes that impact that like that hardcore bullying and harassment can have. 145 00:27:47.000 --> 00:28:05.000 If you just go, oh, it's just trolling that lets the perpetrator kind of get away with it and minimizes what they're at that damage that they are actually doing but by drawing out that clear distinction of no no trolling is just that more entertaining, it's humor-used stuff and cyber 146 00:28:05.000 --> 00:28:12.000 bullying is an attack and has these properties to it. Then there is that easier way to go, no, no, let's just start calling it. 147 00:28:12.000 --> 00:28:27.000 Cyber bullying again. Let's call it site online harassment and then and really not let the people get away with that and you know give that power back to the person who was been done to. 148 00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:32.000 It seems like there's no other I would like to hear Joshua as a as a young person, what's your take on this? 149 00:28:32.000 --> 00:28:52.000 And do you have anything to They need, yeah, views on But this only we can just use. I guess deviance always needs to be defined in relation to a set of norms, right? 150 00:28:52.000 --> 00:29:03.000 And so for example, like in offline behavior, something that's deviant behavior in one country is not convenient behavior in another country. 151 00:29:03.000 --> 00:29:13.000 So given that online doesn't have those clear national orders. Like what set of norms are you defining deviance in relation to? 152 00:29:13.000 --> 00:29:26.000 Is it just Australian liberal norms or? I guess you, yeah, you basically you got Well, the, because specifically my research project was on Facebook. 153 00:29:26.000 --> 00:29:37.000 Comment sections. It has its set of He's, he's what you're allowed to comment on and here's what you're not and if you make these comments they'll be removed and you'll be blocked. 154 00:29:37.000 --> 00:29:46.000 So it's basically there's that bit and then again because They are on comment sections for Australian based media. 155 00:29:46.000 --> 00:29:55.000 Again, it's like any of that cultural like is it just people being rude rather than breaking those hard rules? 156 00:29:55.000 --> 00:30:08.000 That's there, again, that that Australian cultural. Seeing a part of that was being specific to going well like by narrow my scope of comment sections 2 to that I can. 157 00:30:08.000 --> 00:30:16.000 Not have to worry too hard about it like well hang on am I misinterpreting some other cultural cue there. 158 00:30:16.000 --> 00:30:22.000 Yeah. Which brings me to another thing. I know the interesting, you know. 159 00:30:22.000 --> 00:30:34.000 Output finding that I've made is like because These pages have the specific rules that will then block or remove comments. 160 00:30:34.000 --> 00:30:43.000 There are what I've kind of, they've labeled like echoes of cyber devians or shadows of cyber devians where you only have one person. 161 00:30:43.000 --> 00:30:49.000 Commenting and it's usually that person is just commenting how upset they are about some other person who's not there. 162 00:30:49.000 --> 00:30:58.000 We're responding to these other comments. In ways that sound like they're trying to defend themselves against a verbal attack. 163 00:30:58.000 --> 00:31:13.000 But that attack or or other comments are just blank. So you have this half conversation that you can see that you know, often kind of indicates, oh, there was something that was. 164 00:31:13.000 --> 00:31:19.000 Really bad, that got said there that wasn't just people having been impolite to one another. 165 00:31:19.000 --> 00:31:35.000 It was removed from the authorities had to get involved kind of thing. There is interesting outcomes from it. Yeah, I guess also in terms of your other 4 sources. 166 00:31:35.000 --> 00:31:49.000 Science. It's interesting because like what passes as journalism on Sky News Well, be seen as trawling or racism or whatever. 167 00:31:49.000 --> 00:31:58.000 I think it was a comment on a Facebook page on ABC News. Yeah. So how do you deal with that kind of 168 00:31:58.000 --> 00:32:18.000 The context the context in which comment is made that's going to determine its speakers. Yeah, and that is a like that is some of the comments that I make when I have a chapter that talks about would like the title of this one which is the location based stuff like how that location changes what's appropriate and what's not. 169 00:32:18.000 --> 00:32:27.000 So again, even on the satire, what's seen as appropriate there and the name calling that happens there. 170 00:32:27.000 --> 00:32:39.000 Isn't seen as a appropriate on the other pages, but it is seen as humorous. On the satire pages because it is said on a site that is all about irony. 171 00:32:39.000 --> 00:32:53.000 So that element of irony is readable. Almost in the text. Even though irony is one of those hard things to be able to actually like tone of comments is hard to do in a text based. 172 00:32:53.000 --> 00:33:02.000 Thing. So yeah, that that that play is a massive part on What happens in each of those spaces too? 173 00:33:02.000 --> 00:33:10.000 So there's the like irony or the satire dimension, but there's also the left right to mention. 174 00:33:10.000 --> 00:33:16.000 And so that's, yeah, that's another interesting, like, you know. Who raises the idea of climate? 175 00:33:16.000 --> 00:33:29.000 Denialism or goes no climate is. Is varies across the 2 of them. Interestingly though. 176 00:33:29.000 --> 00:33:39.000 The the comments of Lefty this or Lefty that happens on both and and I usually in that aggressive way first before someone starts going, all righty this already that. 177 00:33:39.000 --> 00:33:56.000 The writing this ready that will be a comment in response to Grainy lefty as a derogatory comment and that's on both the IBA saying news and the sky. 178 00:33:56.000 --> 00:34:05.000 Yeah that that form of name calling Yeah. And now that's coming. And once they're going through. 179 00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:13.000 Spread it in if it's time. Yeah. I think sometimes you just have to 180 00:34:13.000 --> 00:34:24.000 Treat it as that's a legal bureaucratic process. And it's got nothing to do with and you as a reset. 181 00:34:24.000 --> 00:34:29.000 Can be a judge of what's ethical and what's not and no one's gonna follow up on Yeah. 182 00:34:29.000 --> 00:34:47.000 So this is how I've kind of, you know, gone about any of the comments that I have kind of put into the writing so far and and making them They are very very similar to what's on available but enough like I feel like I've made some adjustment to it. 183 00:34:47.000 --> 00:35:03.000 It would be harder to distinguish which who's saying what which is what their concern is. So I figured, well, if I do deal with their concern rather than their recommendation. 184 00:35:03.000 --> 00:35:15.000 Of what to do then I can I can get around that. If anything it'll just take a hey I'm just going to make an amendment and say look you're outdated 185 00:35:15.000 --> 00:35:29.000 Yeah. Okay, and I think if we have I want to also I see Angela, is also one of the academics on this, a session online. 186 00:35:29.000 --> 00:35:41.000 And Yellow, would you like to ask when any question? Based on his presentation. I don't know if you had the his presentation. 187 00:35:41.000 --> 00:35:49.000 On cyber 188 00:35:49.000 --> 00:35:57.000 Okay, you just got here. I see Angela just got here, but then you'll you'll receive the recording Angela. It's fine. 189 00:35:57.000 --> 00:36:06.000 What I want to know is I see a It's a pleasure and your lawyer. You can just listen and maybe you'll you'll might be triggered to ask questions as we engage with the presenter. 190 00:36:06.000 --> 00:36:23.000 You I see that This study is was based on the incident that happened in Australia, which is the bushfires of 2019 and 20. 191 00:36:23.000 --> 00:36:45.000 Yes. Between 2019 and 2020 20. The summer that summer. Probably during that summer there was intense wide spread of of this wild wildfires yeah so I'm I will be interested therefore to know What, what damage did this file? 192 00:36:45.000 --> 00:36:54.000 What caused the fires? Is it the nature of just the natural bushfires? How much do loss and damage they cause? 193 00:36:54.000 --> 00:37:03.000 And then what kind of for instance it will have been also interesting to just hear what are some of those comments on Facebook. 194 00:37:03.000 --> 00:37:10.000 That are being made that you will consider to be deviant. All right, so in other satirical. 195 00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:17.000 So I'm, I'll be, I find that I'll be finding that interesting because the fire situation like there is a serious thing. 196 00:37:17.000 --> 00:37:31.000 Yeah. Because it is. Trace crops, it destroys vegetation, it poses a threat to the ecosystem you know but then what I would be interested to get examples of what people are saying. 197 00:37:31.000 --> 00:37:42.000 That's why better, is going to be interesting. Even if it's going to be interesting, even if it's not, but it's basically what is the what are the some of the comments without telling us who made those comments without telling us who made those comments. 198 00:37:42.000 --> 00:38:00.000 I would have liked to hear that. So yeah, there was this interesting thing, there was a lot of news reports on None of the ones that I had, but I remember seeing the news on TV and they talking about how 199 00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:05.000 There was certain news outlets that were promoting the idea that it was arson and things like that. 200 00:38:05.000 --> 00:38:15.000 But then when I was looking for articles There was no outlets talking about it being arson. But there was a lot of commentary. 201 00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:27.000 Within those those new sources that we're talking about so it wasn't that the outlet themselves were saying this thing but the watches of that journalism were the ones talking and promoting this idea. 202 00:38:27.000 --> 00:38:41.000 So there was that that odd distinction of like well then not being told that information from this source but they're being allowed to talk about it a lot. 203 00:38:41.000 --> 00:38:57.000 On that comment section from that source. So there was a lot of, and conspiracy theory around that like and it being only caused by arson and things like that. 204 00:38:57.000 --> 00:39:08.000 However, there is a lot of other reports and the news was saying no it's not this is a these are these like widespread catastrophic natural disasters. 205 00:39:08.000 --> 00:39:17.000 That weren't caused by arson, but. There was comment, commentary. All about that on one of the spaces. 206 00:39:17.000 --> 00:39:29.000 Yeah. Okay, the other thing is because this particular a social incident which is the bushfires. Remember those this often happen every year. 207 00:39:29.000 --> 00:39:37.000 Yeah, then the question is what was so special about this particular one? It was. But that actually would go to your attention. 208 00:39:37.000 --> 00:39:47.000 Or have you been observing? Similar. Tendencies when wish bias actually break out or what happened? 209 00:39:47.000 --> 00:39:58.000 Well, I picked that one because it had that element of People are talking about it. In one way but it's being reported on in another. 210 00:39:58.000 --> 00:40:10.000 So that is to do with that like is it arson is it not and that was what the general population discussion was talking about but the News itself wasn't so much. 211 00:40:10.000 --> 00:40:26.000 Now that he was it was one of the most devastating set a series of bushfires even though yes there are bushfires each year around that time this was the like one of the most devastating and widespread. 212 00:40:26.000 --> 00:40:32.000 One so I figured there's a nice thing and also it was the time. That I was doing like getting started for this project. 213 00:40:32.000 --> 00:40:52.000 Just before that, the bushfires happened. And then the lock downs happened. Oh yeah. All right, I think that will be interesting. 214 00:40:52.000 --> 00:41:07.000 This now, what is even more interesting here is the context. Feather to what Joshua said, the context here is the pick the period in which does happen. 215 00:41:07.000 --> 00:41:21.000 Yeah, could it be that? The mental the stress caused by COVID. This is on the panic around it. 216 00:41:21.000 --> 00:41:36.000 The anxieties are our duty. And the lockdown. The comments that emerged around this bushfire then are in line with those 217 00:41:36.000 --> 00:41:47.000 Or one or another they have in that they were indirectly or directly influenced by the inbarrow then influenced by the inbarrow then then this epidemic that was just being. 218 00:41:47.000 --> 00:41:59.000 I think because it was the other way around here like there was very little talk about COVID. Because there was so much about the bushfires going on. 219 00:41:59.000 --> 00:42:19.000 And it was like before it became so widespread was when the the real most of these bushfires were happening in December, 2,019 was the big the biggest parts and then early January and then it wasn't until I think March. 220 00:42:19.000 --> 00:42:41.000 March that that was when the lockdowns happened. So like a few months. Yeah, yeah, so it was a few months later before the lockdowns and everyone being able to sit in front of the computer and things. 221 00:42:41.000 --> 00:43:06.000 Was impacted by like this to then move into well how people are handling the lockdowns okay super thanks Venn I think we are we are slipping up now we are we are closing and in the session I don't know Angela have you picked up anything here you want to say before we close 222 00:43:06.000 --> 00:43:14.000 I'm yellow. Now, okay, thank you so much. I think that brings us to the end of this session. 223 00:43:14.000 --> 00:43:27.000 It has been recorded. So the good thing is that and the other presentation is not. The other presenter is not available, so it was only one presentation, so we will. 224 00:43:27.000 --> 00:43:46.000 Ended here and I want to thank you for for this presentation even though it was not well attended. Thank you for doing the best and then I think you I hope it generates, stimulate more interest on this issue. 225 00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:50.000 Especially that we are living in a cyber area technological area So thank you so much for this and I wish you all the best. 226 00:43:50.000 --> 00:44:05.000 This back to the end of it. Thanks, Angela for and and others who might be there. A good afternoon and That marks the end of our, thank you so much. 227 00:44:05.000 --> 00:44:08.000 Goodbye. Thank you.